GOODBYE BENN

66 posts
16 March 2014
Chandos
Photographer
Chandos
I know plenty of people who were forced to closed their small businesses under Thatcher, some even had for generations, and went on the dole and stayed on the dole to this day. Thatcher did'nt help small businesses at all despite the likes of Tebbit telling people to get on their bikes Thatcher did her best to puncture their tyres.

Posted 19 March 2014
Edited by Chandos 19 March 2014
mph
Photographer
mph
Chandos
I know plenty of people who were forced to closed their small businesses under Thatcher, some even had for generations, and went on the dole and stayed on the dole to this day. Thatcher did'nt help small businesses at all despite the likes of Tebbit telling people to get on their bikes Thatcher did her best to puncture their tyres.
Yes, fortunately now she has gone, businesses no longer close. In 1970, manufacturing accounted for 20.57% of UK GDP. By 1979 that was down to 17.62% of GDP. By the time she left office, that decline had continued - albeit at a slightly slower pace, down to 15.18%. Now it is much lower, according to the ONS - down to 9.68% in 2010. At the same time days lost to industrial disputes shot down too - from around 900,000 a month when Thatcher became prime minister to 183,000 in November 1990
Posted 19 March 2014
tonycsm
Photographer
tonycsm
Chandos

......... and went on the dole and stayed on the dole to this day. .


On the dole for how many years?????? Anyone on the dole for that long who isn't prevented from working through physical or mental incapcity doesn't even deserve dole as they're just taking the pi**!

I'm surprised that Thatcher didn't also get the blame for closing the Tin mines down in Cornwall or the Lead mines in the Pennines or maybe the Woolen mills of West Yorkshire.
I've worked for myself all of my lfe before, during and after the Thatcher years and have never once been unemployed for a day.

Contrary to the socialist view of the world, this country doesn't owe anyone a living....if anyone really wants to work and can't find a job then they can 'create' one and find employment that way...there's always a job out there if you're willing to put in the effort and hard work instead of expecting someone else to provide you with everything!
Posted 19 March 2014
Sdeve
Photographer
Sdeve
One thing that can be said of Thatcher is the worked according to her beliefs. Compare her to Bliar, he was for sale. An utterly corrupt, self serving, and wholly contemptible criminal, who betrayed the working class, his party, his colleagues, and his country. He even put his God on hold until he could dump the country onto Gurning Gordon, and yet in spite of this, most of which is acknowledged, he doesn't get a tenth of the hatred the left spouts about Thatcher. Why not? As I have said, it's the left wing class war syndrome that hates anybody for no better reason than how they speak.

Posted 19 March 2014
Sdeve
Photographer
Sdeve
Bearing in mind the OP...

Quotes from Benn.

(9 April 2013, as reported in The Guardian),

"Margaret Thatcher was a very powerful, rightwing force in society. She followed her beliefs and had clear objectives. Her policy was to reverse the trends in modern politics that were made possible by the trade unions being legalised. She decided to eradicate the power of the unions, undermine local government and privatise assets - and these were the three policies of the labour movement.
It was a major attack on democracy and at first it carried some public support, but then it became unstuck, and in the end, it was rejected. But ideas always come back and the modern Tory party is influenced by her ideas.
Although I thought she was wrong, she said what she meant and meant what she said. It was not about style with her; it was substance - I don't think she listened to spin doctors, she just had a clear idea and followed it through.
I remember her at the funeral of MP Eric Heffer. I was asked to make a speech and as I was waiting, there was someone behind me coughing. It was Mrs Thatcher, and at the end I thanked her for coming and she burst into tears. She had come out of respect for someone whose opinions she disagreed with."

and

(14 July 2008, Interviewed on BBC News 24 by Mr Andrew Neil, On Tony Blair),

'I think without any doubt he was the worst Labour leader we ever had. He abandoned the commitment to a fairer society. After all, what was wrong with Clause IV, trying to get a fair reward for your labour? What's wrong with the United Nations charter, which he tore up. Why didn't he consult his cabinet, he didn't. Why didn't he consult parliament, he didn't. Why didn't he listen to the Labour Party Conference, he didn't. I mean he ran it like a medieval monarch!'


Interrupted by Mr Andrew Neil, Tony was asked why Tony Blair was the only Labour leader to win three general elections in a row,

'Well, I think because the British Establishment couldn't believe their luck. They had Thatcherite policies carried through by a Labour Prime Minister, able to call on the Labour Party to support him out of loyalty, and although he got sniping in the press.....I think New Labour has had the best press. Why? Because they were following the policies of Mrs Thatcher. That's my conviction.'

Posted 19 March 2014
Jackass
Photographer
Jackass
I was brought up in a socialist environment, me father being an ex miner.

I remember the state of things in general when the miner's strike brought down the Conservative government in the early 70's. I remember the state of things in general when the Conservatives replaced the Labour government in 1979. I remember the state of things in general when New Labour eventually replaced the Conservatives in 1997. I remember the state of things in general when the Conservatives replaced New Labour last time round.

Thatcher did what no-one else had the balls to do to get the British economy competitive again. To what extent she had to go to achieve this is debatable, some think she went too far. Many lives were blighted by her policies that's true, but many were also blighted by the Benn supported union activities throughout the 60's & 70's, something which is ignored by Thatcher's critics. Something else that is overlooked is that Thatcher could not possibly have done what she did without the support of the general population, as the Heath administration found out in 1974 when he stood up to the unions and asked the country to decide "who rules?". By 1984 the country was sick to the stomach of the behaviour of the unions, and Thatcher was allowed to take them on.

The biggest condemnation of them all in my opinion is the fact that whichever government is in power, the gap between rich and poor widens inexorably. It has always amazed me that an original and intelligent thinker such as Benn could never grasp the fact that communism simply does not work.

Posted 22 March 2014
pentax5AC
Photographer
pentax5AC
My sentiments entirely! The original post was meant to demonstrate the enormous gulf between the continued reaction to Margaret Thatcher’s death by the blinkered, hostile and often anarchist Left; the youngest and most vocal of whom weren’t even around at the time of her period in office, as opposed to the more considered and conservative response to Tony Benn’s demise from the political Right.
We are continually reminded by the by an extremely biased and socialist media of the threat posed by the political Right, but as you have rightly stated above, the greatest threat ever calculated to undermine democracy in this country from within, came from the militant, trade unionist Left.
I also remember the misery caused by relentless trade union strikes, those never ending and unrealistic demands used as part their overtly political agenda, which, by 1973, had nothing whatsoever to do with pay and conditions, but everything to do with forcing Heath from office and replacing his administration with a Labour government of THEIR choosing.
Mrs Thatcher responded with the toughest anti-union legislation in Europe to bring them back in to line. Isn’t it interesting how no political leader of any party has attempted to repeal it since.


Posted 22 March 2014
carshaltonkev
Photographer
carshaltonkev
"We are continually reminded by the by an extremely biased and socialist media of the threat posed by the political Right" Excuse me, pentax5AC, have you ever wondered if you are losing your grip on reality?
Posted 22 March 2014
mph
Photographer
mph
carshaltonkev
"We are continually reminded by the by an extremely biased and socialist media of the threat posed by the political Right" Excuse me, pentax5AC, have you ever wondered if you are losing your grip on reality?
If you think the media in general are right wing I fear it is you losing the grip on reality!
Posted 22 March 2014
carshaltonkev
Photographer
carshaltonkev
And there I was thinking that the media are controlled by the rich and powerful and their friends like Murdoch. Or are you classing the BBC as left wing? I would say that the BBC try to be balanced. Or are you classing the Daily Mail as left wing?! But no point in arguing, because I will get nowhere with the right wing headbangers on Purestorm.
Posted 22 March 2014
mph
Photographer
mph
carshaltonkev

And there I was thinking that the media are controlled by the rich and powerful and their friends like Murdoch. Or are you classing the BBC as left wing? I would say that the BBC try to be balanced. Or are you classing the Daily Mail as left wing?! But no point in arguing, because I will get nowhere with the right wing headbangers on Purestorm.


Well if you feel the Guardian, Mirror and Independent are right wing - and that the BBC succeeds in its quest to be neutral...............

Helen Boaden, the BBC’s former director of news, who is now the head of radio has recently admitted that in the past the culture at the corporation meant that staff had failed to take campaign groups such as Migrationwatch seriously and has a "deep liberal bias" (i.e. left wing)

Even the Sun backed Blair in 97 - and the FT backed labour in previous elections.

I was not talking about the Daily Mail which I accept is a comic.  The Telegraph is, I agree, on the right though far from being an unreserved supporter of the Conservatives, any more than I am. 

But arguing with someone who dismisses those with a differing opinion as "head bangers" will of course be ultimately fruitless.

Posted 22 March 2014
Edited by mph 22 March 2014
pentax5AC
Photographer
pentax5AC
Yes...What is it about socialists that they can’t engage in any form of political debate without becoming personal?
All modern life, not least media presentation, is governed by a rigid adherence to the politically correct, and the invasive socialist ideology that underpins it.
What the Americans refer to as “creeping socialism” has permeated EVERY aspect of British life to the point where many now accept it as normal. Nothing illustrates the point better than immigration, which instead of just being a political matter for voters to decide has become instead a contentious MORAL one.
In other words a climate has been fostered (through socialist conditioning) in which members of the public with legitimate concerns about immigration are frightened to express them in case they are labelled “racist”. We have all heard the phrase...”I’m not racist... but!” Essentially an apology for having an opinion that does not conform to the socialist held view that anyone to the political right of Tony Benn has to be a lederhosen wearing, neo-Nazi thug!


Posted 22 March 2014
carshaltonkev
Photographer
carshaltonkev
I have met many people with left-wing views who also hold views that many would consider as "politically incorrect". I have also met some very staunch Tory voters, who are very politically correct.

So to see the rise of political correctness as some kind of "creeping socialism" is IMHO, very misguided.

I probably agree with you on something. In my opinion, political correctness has become totally out of control; but then who would like to go back to say the 1970s, where you only have to look at some (not all) comedy TV programs, to see that there was some rather offensive material being watched by millions- with racist and homeophobic stereotypes. Women portrayed as purely sex objects etc... Maybe you would like to go back to this?

I'm not a sociologist. Mabe they could tell you why being PC is so important these days, but I don't think it is anything to do with creeping socialism.

It is because you hold extreme views like this that I put you in the "headbanger" category and make me realise that arguing here is a complete waste of time.

Posted 22 March 2014
mph
Photographer
mph
carshaltonkev

Women portrayed as purely sex objects etc... Maybe you would like to go back to this? 


Phew - thank God you don't get any of that attitude here!

Posted 22 March 2014
carshaltonkev
Photographer
carshaltonkev
Who are these "socialists" you have such contempt for? How many of them are there- and what influence, if any, do they have on this country- and the way it is run?

I assume you would regard the recently departed Tony Benn and Bob Crow as socialists, but does it also include anybody who votes Labour? Would you regard Tony Blair as a "socialist"? And if not, when did Britain last have a "socialist" government? When Attlee was PM?

Yet you say "creeping socialism has permeated EVERY aspect of British life."

I am sure no current Tory MP would come out with some of the politically incorrect comments that were acceptable and commonly used in the 1970s. If they did, they would get into serious trouble. So does this mean that all current Tory MPs have been infected by "creeping socialism". I think not!

Posted 22 March 2014
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