Your 'argument" could have come from the DoT it is so full of sentiment and bereft of facts or logic. Flood defences have to show a payback of £8 for every pound spent. This project is forecast to bring a return of between £1.20 and best case £1.40 for every pound spent. And that doesn't include any money for improving lines which connect with the very limited number of stations the line would serve. Due to the economics it will be cheaper to fly from Manchester than catch this train, and unless you are travelling from very near both stations it will probably be quicker.redbaronRubbish. We should have built the thing decades ago. It's utterly absurd not having a proper high speed link to the north of this country. Just a shame we have to waste years and millions of pounds responding to endless pressure groups all using it as an excuse for a bit of self promotion and grandstanding.
The only continental gauge railway in the UK was destroyed by Beeching and is now in part a heritage railway. They are spending millions trying to bring the line from Southampton to the Midlands up to continental standards, but the problem is as soon as a diversion is needed for maintenance the continental loading gauge trains cannot run. Governments throughout from the second world war onwards have never taken railways seriously. Our Victorian forefathers had the vision to look forward years into the future unlike modern governments that cannot see any further forward than the next election.stolenfacesIt is quite interesting to note that HS1 and HS2 will be the only continental gauge railways, but they won't be able to run through trains from Manchester to Paris etc.
Whilst I don't disagree with your points..... Surely it would be better if you could move freight from Manchester to Munich on the same gauge railway. If it's a choice wouldn't that help the economy (and planet) more than passenger trains.MaoZhuHS2 would be the right solution if it was seen as an extension to the European high speed network rather than an isolated High speed line. As it stands at the moment its a bit like HS1 was when it stopped in the middle of Kent and then went slow all the way to Waterloo. It should be linked properly to HS1 not by some some northern London branch line that will never work. If it was fully integrated into the existing passenger network it would free up an enormous capacity on the normal lines for freight. The ability to travel from Manchester to Munich should be what we are looking for not from Stockport to Stockwell
I cant argue with that one at all. I believe we are now suffering from the irrational way the Beeching closures took place. Ok I know its history, but the Great Central line was for exactly the purpose you are on about. When you see our trains struggling to get a container under a bridge, or worse still a 1940's British steam loco having its chimney shortened because we have reduced are loading gauges over time to save money on maintenance it makes you realise that railways have been neglected by governments for years. Compare a British freight train to an American one, the difference is huge, but we were always told that the Americans didn't like rail. What is needed is as you say the capacity to run freight right through, the channel tunnel allows that now but once north of the tunnel it is back to UK loading gauge. But I do not believe it would cost that much to bring a lot of lines up to Continental gauge, in a lot of cases it just needs the years of ballast build up removed. But once north of London is where I see huge problems for freight. To increase the capacity of the west coast mainline would be a huge job, look how long and how much the last upgrade took. To get the extra capacity it would mean adding extra tracks for mile after mile, that in my view could cost as much if not more than HS2, imaging trying to add extra tracks through Birmingham or any other town for that matter. Thats why I believe HS2 could be the right solution.stolenfacesWhilst I don't disagree with your points..... Surely it would be better if you could move freight from Manchester to Munich on the same gauge railway. If it's a choice wouldn't that help the economy (and planet) more than passenger trains.
I agree with you completely on this. It's about, in my opinion, marketing people wanting something to bankroll themselves a bottomless pit of money from the government, the estimated costs have already gone up, and nothing has already been approved yet. Amazingly, the government seems willing to go ahead with the plan. I also believe it is to make people who are filthy rich, more rich, whilst paying the actual ground workers next to nothing, plus destroying the natural habitat of animalsJohnmphotoThis high speed train is supposedly going benefit the Midlands and the North West. Are people living in London and the south East going to travel up to Midland and the North West to work? The train probably won’t be much faster due to the speed restriction in the tunnels and on the curves. I think people are going to travel down to the South East to find work and that means the London and the SE will become richer increasing the North South divide.