A question on MUA rates

A question on MUA rates

38 posts
22 Jan 2010
cgwebster
Photographer
cgwebster
There has been a few threads here on how taken for granted MUA's are, how people take the P by constantly posting for TF* work etc. but none of the threads really informed me how much a MUA should cost. Apologies for my ignorance on this and if I've missed something, I'm afraid to say I have only worked with MUA's on a TF* basis in the past (not from this site though).

For instance, do you have a menu of rates (by that I mean an hourly cost + material charges depending on what is required) or do you do bespoke pricing per assignment or some other formulae ?

The reason I'm asking is I'm looking into some commercial opportunities and need to know what to budget and thus give the client a realistic quote.

Colin
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Victoria_Howard
Make Up Artist
Victoria_Howard
Sent you a link via pm
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Edited by Victoria_Howard 22 Jan 2010
cgwebster
Photographer
cgwebster
Victoria_Howard

Sent you a link via pm


Thanks for the message, appreciated!

Colin
Posted 22 Jan 2010
benharvey
Photographer
benharvey
was it secret?
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
Photographer
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
At the expense of bringing the wrath of a 'foundation' of MUA's down on me I think that MUA's are no more exempt from working TF* than photographers or models.
(Some) MUA's seem to think that TF* is only applicable if its others working for them and that their part in the creative process should be paid for. 
Just think of the expense it would come to for a new MUA to book both a model and pay the photographer for the images produced. Even those (few) who have had the professionalism to pay out for the services of models and photographers would I'm sure admit that while leaning their art didn't pay a fee to everybody they practiced on.
The funny thing (I find) is that it is not always the best MUA's who seem to doing the shouting and I'm sure that the photographers who support them are often after  freebies themselves.
Now let me say here that a 'good' MUA is an important thing and worth every penny of their fee ( which will be whatever they ask — the same as any other professional) but until they can prove via images of their work that they are worth that fee then they like everyone else (may) need to work TF*
TF* is a two (or even a three) way street. Those who don't need to do it, wont, and those who think it will be in their interest to, will.
If I was doing an important shoot then I wouldn't trust using an unproved MUA just to save a couple of quid, but I would work with a new MUA and provide my time, skills and images for FREE if they were also giving their time , skill and materials for free.
I am not an MUA so cannot give you rates, let's see if you get any rates in open forum.
Mike.

Posted 22 Jan 2010
cgwebster
Photographer
cgwebster
benharvey

was it secret?


Absolutely emoticon
Posted 22 Jan 2010
cgwebster
Photographer
cgwebster
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST

At the expense of bringing the wrath of a 'foundation' of MUA's down on me I think that MUA's are no more exempt from working TF* than photographers or models.
(Some) MUA's seem to think that TF* is only applicable if its others working for them and that their part in the creative process should be paid for. 
Just think of the expense it would come to for a new MUA to book both a model and pay the photographer for the images produced. Even those (few) who have had the professionalism to pay out for the services of models and photographers would I'm sure admit that while leaning their art didn't pay a fee to everybody they practiced on.
The funny thing (I find) is that it is not always the best MUA's who seem to doing the shouting and I'm sure that the photographers who support them are often after  freebies themselves.
Now let me say here that a 'good' MUA is an important thing and worth every penny of their fee ( which will be whatever they ask — the same as any other professional) but until they can prove via images of their work that they are worth that fee then they like everyone else (may) need to work TF*
TF* is a two (or even a three) way street. Those who don't need to do it, wont, and those who think it will be in their interest to, will.
If I was doing an important shoot then I wouldn't trust using an unproved MUA just to save a couple of quid, but I would work with a new MUA and provide my time, skills and images for FREE if they were also giving their time , skill and materials for free.
I am not an MUA so cannot give you rates, let's see if you get any rates in open forum.
Mike.



All good points, but I was asking about paid, commercial rates and how these are made up. I wasn't trying to start another "should MUA's do TF* or not" thread, honest! emoticon

Colin
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Secondskin
Make Up Artist
Secondskin
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST

At the expense of bringing the wrath of a 'foundation' of MUA's down on me I think that MUA's are no more exempt from working TF* than photographers or models.
(Some) MUA's seem to think that TF* is only applicable if its others working for them and that their part in the creative process should be paid for. 
Just think of the expense it would come to for a new MUA to book both a model and pay the photographer for the images produced. Even those (few) who have had the professionalism to pay out for the services of models and photographers would I'm sure admit that while leaning their art didn't pay a fee to everybody they practiced on.
The funny thing (I find) is that it is not always the best MUA's who seem to doing the shouting and I'm sure that the photographers who support them are often after  freebies themselves.
Now let me say here that a 'good' MUA is an important thing and worth every penny of their fee ( which will be whatever they ask — the same as any other professional) but until they can prove via images of their work that they are worth that fee then they like everyone else (may) need to work TF*
TF* is a two (or even a three) way street. Those who don't need to do it, wont, and those who think it will be in their interest to, will.
If I was doing an important shoot then I wouldn't trust using an unproved MUA just to save a couple of quid, but I would work with a new MUA and provide my time, skills and images for FREE if they were also giving their time , skill and materials for free.
I am not an MUA so cannot give you rates, let's see if you get any rates in open forum.
Mike.



Ha ha, Im one of the loud 'shouters'  ....oh dear, does that mean im crap??? lol
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Secondskin
Make Up Artist
Secondskin
cgwebster

All good points, but I was asking about paid, commercial rates and how these are made up. I wasn't trying to start another "should MUA's do TF* or not" thread, honest! emoticon

Colin


Its ok Colin...You didnt come across as if you were anyhow. emoticon
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Secondskin
Make Up Artist
Secondskin
And can i just add..what is wrong with Victoria  privately pm'ing Colin??? I know lots of photographers and models who wouldnt dream of putting their rates on a forum??why should we ?? I dont have anything to hide at all, my rates are fair and suitable but its my business and i wouldnt splash it all over here..like i dont splash anything else about my private affairs...
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Edited by Secondskin 22 Jan 2010
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST

At the expense of bringing the wrath of a 'foundation' of MUA's down on me I think that MUA's are no more exempt from working TF* than photographers or models.
(Some) MUA's seem to think that TF* is only applicable if its others working for them and that their part in the creative process should be paid for. 
Just think of the expense it would come to for a new MUA to book both a model and pay the photographer for the images produced. Even those (few) who have had the professionalism to pay out for the services of models and photographers would I'm sure admit that while leaning their art didn't pay a fee to everybody they practiced on.
The funny thing (I find) is that it is not always the best MUA's who seem to doing the shouting and I'm sure that the photographers who support them are often after  freebies themselves.
Now let me say here that a 'good' MUA is an important thing and worth every penny of their fee ( which will be whatever they ask — the same as any other professional) but until they can prove via images of their work that they are worth that fee then they like everyone else (may) need to work TF*
TF* is a two (or even a three) way street. Those who don't need to do it, wont, and those who think it will be in their interest to, will.
If I was doing an important shoot then I wouldn't trust using an unproved MUA just to save a couple of quid, but I would work with a new MUA and provide my time, skills and images for FREE if they were also giving their time , skill and materials for free.
I am not an MUA so cannot give you rates, let's see if you get any rates in open forum.
Mike.




You misunderstand completely.  When muas start out, a lot are very willing to work tf to build a portfolio... but when you have a profile full of images and get pms saying, "I love your work babe, fancy a tf shoot???" As i do on my mua profile on a regular basis, it makes you quite cross.  If they love your work so much, they'll pay for it.  I love the work of several photographers on here, and I will damn well pay if I want to work with them, in fact already have, as model AND mua.
Plus back to the old and tired, but very appropriate argument, you can re-use a camera, and a cd of images costs buggar all, but you can't re-use expensive produsts once they're on someones face!

Also, when a request for a tf mua states 'I have already forked out a fortune on this shoot, so don't have the funds to pay an mua' or 'you may get published', you know that either someone else is getting paid, or money will be made from the shoot.  So why not the mua?

If new models and photographers or amateurs want the indulgence of the skills of a good, qualified and well equipt mua, they should be prepared to pay for it.  Else aim it at new or student muas, not request 'very good, experienced muas' for tf, as many do.

To go back to original op, I charge according to assignment, dependant on materials needed, distance to travel, and hours required, as I think a lot of muas do.  But everyone runs their business differently, some have set rates for hours worked, but request travel on top.  The best thing to do, is if you like an mua, message them personally and ask their individual rates for your own assignment.

I'm probably quite a newbie, despite having 4 years experience and currently doing a degree in special effects, compared to some of the wonderful muas on here, and I think they're severely under appreciated, and given a very hard time.  Well done for asking a very valid question about how rates etc work for muas, if you don't ask, how are you supposed to know?  And lets hope lots more models and photographers start to invest in muas, there are far too many wotsits out there!!!!!!
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
Photographer
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
Secondskin

Ha ha, Im one of the loud 'shouters'  ....oh dear, does that mean im crap??? lol


It is not in my nature to insult (or praise) individuals work, so:

Without even looking at your port.........not necessary, my post was worded very carefully at no point did I say all or that it was written in stone and I was quick to say it was my opinion only. I certainly did not say that anybody was crap (although I have seen MUA's who on the strength of their folio seem to think that they are far better than their printed work suggests (perhaps they should do more TF*

 I agree with the OP that this subject has been done to death. Some photographers also shout about TF* but I think MUA,s shout loudest.

Of course there is nothing wrong with sending rates by PM this is up to the individual but the OP posted in the first place because he could not find the information he wanted. So, I would say that in open forum that you would expect to pay (depending on the job) £25 per hour for an experienced MUA. Much more for an exceptional one and a lot less for others. Like everything else it doesn't always go on the quality of one's work. It goes on what they ask and can get because they are worth it. 

Now if anybody wants to post their rates then people like myself who come across this thread can look at that persons work and decide for them selfs if they are worth it.

Mike.




Posted 22 Jan 2010
barone
Photographer
barone
"A question on MUA rates" As with anything contact the MUA of your choice & ask them & they will send you their rates & explain what you get for the money.. MUA's are worth their weight in gold...so make sure you get a short slim one & not too soon after christmas...
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
Photographer
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
misty_model


You misunderstand completely.  When muas start out, a lot are very willing to work tf to build a portfolio... but when you have a profile full of images and get pm's saying, "I love your work babe, fancy a tf shoot???" As i do on my mua profile on a regular basis, it makes you quite cross.  If they love your work so much, they'll pay for it.  I love the work of several photographers on here, and I will damn well pay if I want to work with them, in fact already have, as model AND mua.
Plus back to the old and tired, but very appropriate argument, you can re-use a camera, and a cd of images costs buggar all, but you can't re-use expensive produsts once they're on someones face!

Also, when a request for a tf mua states 'I have already forked out a fortune on this shoot, so don't have the funds to pay an mua' or 'you may get published', you know that either someone else is getting paid, or money will be made from the shoot.  So why not the mua?

If new models and photographers or amateurs want the indulgence of the skills of a good, qualified and well equipt mua, they should be prepared to pay for it.  Else aim it at new or student muas, not request 'very good, experienced muas' for tf, as many do.

To go back to original op, I charge according to assignment, dependant on materials needed, distance to travel, and hours required, as I think a lot of muas do.  But everyone runs their business differently, some have set rates for hours worked, but request travel on top.  The best thing to do, is if you like an mua, message them personally and ask their individual rates for your own assignment.

I'm probably quite a newbie, despite having 4 years experience and currently doing a degree in special effects, compared to some of the wonderful muas on here, and I think they're severely under appreciated, and given a very hard time.  Well done for asking a very valid question about how rates etc work for muas, if you don't ask, how are you supposed to know?  And lets hope lots more models and photographers start to invest in muas, there are far too many wotsits out there!!!!!!


I could not agree with you more on most of what you have said including the fact that 'proven' models (and togs) also get the TF* requests
While I know that professional MU products and equipment is expensive I cannot agree that it is more so than a photographers output ( and even models have many out of pocket expenses) I have just paid out £1,600 for a "secondhand" camera body. Secondhand mind and only the body only. The guy who I bought it from paid £50 just to check out it was ok before he sold it to me because he dropped it and wanted to check it was ok. On using it for the first time the tripod fell and it ended up in the snow. 
Now before anyone says well if you have £1,600 why moan about paying MUAs. Well, I haven't got much money I'm like every one else on the bones of my a*. I want lots of other new equipment I simply cannot afford. Plus I haven't said that 'good' MUA's shouldn't be paid (what they deserve)
The whole case of MUAs paying out more per shoot has been discussed before and (for me ) holds little water.
Other than that I am in total agreement 'proven' MUAs  don't need to TF* (nor do proven models or togs) Proven MUAs don't 'need' to shout about it as they are far to busy working and being paid for it.
Trade for SKILLS is never going to go away and god bless anyone with the balls to ask for it. 

Mike.
Posted 22 Jan 2010
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
Photographer
Mike_Dainty_ARTIST
barone

"A question on MUA rates"As with anything contact the MUA of your choice & ask them & they will send you their rates & explain what you get for the money..MUA's are worth their weight in gold...so make sure you get a short slim one & not too soon after christmas...


Look up the MUA's who have worked with this guy and pay them whatever they ask and don't forget to say 'please' and 'thank you' emoticon
Posted 22 Jan 2010
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