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Warning!!! Paypal Changes

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Shackled Maidens is off-line
28 May 2015 02:51
ShackledMaidens
Photographer
ShackledMaidens
Location
United Kingdom
Hampshire
Basingstoke

https://www.paypal.com/hu/webapps/mpp/ua/upcoming-policies-full

Amendment to the PayPal User Agreement.

Intellectual Property

We are adding a new paragraph to section 1.3., which outlines the licence and rights that you give to us and to the PayPal Group (see paragraph 12 below for the definition of “PayPal Group”) to use content that you post for publication using the Services. A similar paragraph features in the Privacy Policy, which is removed by the addition of this paragraph to the User Agreement. The new paragraph at section 1.3 reads as follows:

“When providing us with content or posting content (in each case for publication, whether on- or off-line) using the Services, you grant the PayPal Group a non-exclusive, worldwide, perpetual, irrevocable, royalty-free, sublicensable (through multiple tiers) right to exercise any and all copyright, publicity, trademarks, database rights and intellectual property rights you have in the content, in any media known now or in the future. Further, to the fullest extent permitted under applicable law, you waive your moral rights and promise not to assert such rights against the PayPal Group, its sublicensees or assignees. You represent and warrant that none of the following infringe any intellectual property right: your provision of content to us, your posting of content using the Services, and the PayPal Group’s use of such content (including of works derived from it) in connection with the Services.”


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
28 May 2015 02:55
RedChecker
Photographer
RedChecker
Location
United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

It's nothing to worry about, they're simply covering their arses for distribution of your data across worldwide computer networks when you upload it. They have absolutely no interest or intention to steal anyone's images (just like Facebook).
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Bob is off-linePlatinum Member
28 May 2015 03:32
Bob
Photographer
Bob
Location
United Kingdom
Devon
Honiton

Quote from RedChecker
They have absolutely no interest or intention to steal anyone's images.



Should that not have read: In my opinion they have absolutely no interest or intention to steal anyone's images at this moment in time?

The wording of the agreement, which is quite close to that first originated in the mid to late 1990s by IP lawyers working for some of the large UK publishing houses attempting to find ways around CDPA 1988 effectively gives, should they so choose, PPG and/or anyone who sub-licences from them or buys their business the copyright holder's irrevocable permission to use and sell the image without hindrance in any medium for ever more. Additionally, the agreement allows PPG et al to ignore the originator's moral rights to the fullest extent permissible in the company's legal jurisdiction and prevents the PayPal user taking action against them if they object to the way their content is used or sub-licensed.

To the general public these terms merely represent a CYA by PPG, but to those who own saleable image content (including Matty, myself and many other photographers on this site) they could effectively be an irreversible non-exclusive 'copyright grab' to which they have unwittingly agreed. As always, it is best read what the contract actually says rather than seeing what you presume it might mean.
  • "you grant the PayPal Group a non-exclusive, worldwide, perpetual, irrevocable, royalty-free, sublicensable (through multiple tiers) right to exercise any and all copyright, publicity, trademarks, database rights and intellectual property rights you have in the content, in any media known now or in the future"

  • "to the fullest extent permitted under applicable law, you waive your moral rights and promise not to assert such rights against the PayPal Group, its sublicensees or assignees."
PPG might not currently have any intent to exploit images uploaded to their site, but if they or a subsequent buyer should decide to cash in on image content in the future the above wording would also be a CYA to prevent action being taken against them by the originator of the work.

Bob


redbaron is off-lineSilver Member
28 May 2015 04:33
redbaron
Photographer
redbaron
Location
United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

I think it is right to be aware of it and we should not simply dismiss it as just a legal necessity. Clearly they have not needed it is all the years until now!

I'm not quite so clear how this would impact though, unless they are bringing out some new service. As far as I see it the only images that I would potentially place with Paypal like this are graphics for buttons or banners. Well worth spreading the word. Someone may have a deeper understanding of the consequences than us
Photography and Studio hire www.immortaleye.co.uk


Skymouse is onlineGold Member
28 May 2015 15:00
skymouse
Photographer
skymouse
Location
United Kingdom
London
London

Quote from Bob

  • "you grant the PayPal Group a non-exclusive, worldwide, perpetual, irrevocable, royalty-free, sublicensable (through multiple tiers) right to exercise any and all copyright, publicity, trademarks, database rights and intellectual property rights you have in the content, in any media known now or in the future"





When I first saw this discussed, I thought "ah yes, just the usual non-controversial licence". But then I read it again and the phrase that I have put in red is striking. You're not granting a simple usage licence. You're granting a licence to exercise all IP rights that you have in the content. Your rights may include the right to assign the copyright or grant certain kinds of esxclusive licence. So notwithstanding the fact that the licence granted to Paypal is itself non-exclusive, it is unpredicatbly extensive.

A later paragraph says that you represent and warrant that this grant does not infringe any rights. That means that if even your own actions later conflict with the rights granted to Paypal — for example if Paypal grant an exclusive sub-licence for a certain kind of use, and you later grant a similar usage right to another party, your grant will infringe Paypal's sub-licensee's right — and the warranty puts the onus on you!

It's a kind of crazy genius ... crazy ... but genius!
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx.


Alta_Igor is off-line
29 May 2015 05:45
Alta_Igor
Photographer
This member has been reset to pending

Location
United Kingdom
London


OK, call my thick, but I do not really understand. Is it saying that if we have an 'images for sale' site and use paypal as the payment gateway and facility, Paypal have the rights to all the images on that site?



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