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Looking for a new camera

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Profile Pictures is off-line
18 June 2014 02:35
profilepictures
Photographer
profilepictures
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United Kingdom
Suffolk
Bury St Edmunds

Quote from Chandos
If you already have a Canon FF dSLR I don't understand why anyone would choose to "upgrade" to a 6D unless you own the first generation 5D and you want a bit more res and better lowlight. The 6D is the current Canon entry level for people moving into FF and despite improve AF I still don't rate it as a better camera than the 5D2 or 1Ds1 & 1Ds2.



Have to say here, the 6d is a step up from the 5d2, and really the 5d original has a very limited usable ISO range ( suffering as it does with not only noise issues but also 'banding' in the noise pattern which makes it hard work to remove from a picture. It's not all things to all men, so doesn't do fast action too well and has limited focus points, but for difficult light conditions and general IQ, it's a bargain.
If you're going canon and want flexibility, a 6d and a 70d would be my suggestion if the 5d3 is unaffordable. Mind you I don't know too many photographers who use the full potential of the 5d3 too often, and have noted several who appear to have the loosest understanding of its functions.


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
18 June 2014 02:41
RedChecker
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RedChecker
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Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

Quote from Chandos
If you already have a Canon FF dSLR I don't understand why anyone would choose to "upgrade" to a 6D unless you own the first generation 5D and you want a bit more res and better lowlight. The 6D is the current Canon entry level for people moving into FF and despite improve AF I still don't rate it as a better camera than the 5D2 or 1Ds1 & 1Ds2.



I can only assume you've not used a 6D to compare to the latter cameras you mention.

In terms of useability it is an awkward mix.  It's AF has only been improved in terms of low light sensitivity and mostly on the centre AF point, it hasn't improved in normal working conditions (due to lack of X-point focus sensors other than the centre one so you still get RedChecker is a naughty person ty focussing when using those).  The interface is somewhat awkward as well, especially AF point selection (although it's massively improved over the archaic 1Ds I and II).  Some would also argue it's a bit small and admittedly I do prefer to have the 5D or 1Ds in my hands as they're noticeably more substantial (don't take that as being better quality though, the 6D is a very nicely made camera and certainly better made than the 5D).

Where it does shine however is picture quality and in low light can give a 5D3 a good run for its money and arguably beat it, there are many people who've also upgraded from 5D2 bodies and agree it is an improved camera regarding final image quality, even though the useability of it in terms of ergonomics & interface are slightly worse.  The worst thing going against it for natural light work is its slightly annoying sync speed of 1/180th and it has problems with some third party TTL flash triggers (as does the 1Dx and 5D3 also, it seems Canon have messed about with the TTL protocols on these).

In studio conditions however, there's very little between the 5D (1), 1DsII and 6D other than the resolution (and as I said in an earlier post the 1DsII is the best of the lot, argueably due to its lack of AA filter).
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Simon Chan is off-line
18 June 2014 03:55
Chandos
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Merseyside
Liverpool

Quote from RedChecker
I can only assume you've not used a 6D to compare to the latter cameras you mention.



In terms of useability it is an awkward mix.  It's AF has only been improved in terms of low light sensitivity and mostly on the centre AF point, it hasn't improved in normal working conditions (due to lack of X-point focus sensors other than the centre one so you still get Chandos is a naughty person ty focussing when using those).  The interface is somewhat awkward as well, especially AF point selection (although it's massively improved over the archaic 1Ds I and II).  Some would also argue it's a bit small and admittedly I do prefer to have the 5D or 1Ds in my hands as they're noticeably more substantial (don't take that as being better quality though, the 6D is a very nicely made camera and certainly better made than the 5D).



Where it does shine however is picture quality and in low light can give a 5D3 a good run for its money and arguably beat it, there are many people who've also upgraded from 5D2 bodies and agree it is an improved camera regarding final image quality, even though the useability of it in terms of ergonomics & interface are slightly worse.  The worst thing going against it for natural light work is its slightly annoying sync speed of 1/180th and it has problems with some third party TTL flash triggers (as does the 1Dx and 5D3 also, it seems Canon have messed about with the TTL protocols on these).



In studio conditions however, there's very little between the 5D (1), 1DsII and 6D other than the resolution (and as I said in an earlier post the 1DsII is the best of the lot, argueably due to its lack of AA filter).




Agin you are pretty confrontational in your postings as others have noticed. I knew you would respond with trivial put downs. I have tested the 6D and don't consider it as a real upgrade or great improvement from the 5D2 or the other Canon FF, your take might be different but I have my take too. The 6D AF is an improvement over the original 5D and 5D2, it may be marginal but it remains an improvement nonetheless so no point slating me.

Again I do not dispute that the 6D is an improvement over the original 5D as I posted earlier. My take is if you already have a 5D2, 1Ds1 & 1Ds2 I would not consider buying a 6D as it adds little over these cameras and inferior in other aspects. There might be other features that is conveniently implemented in modern cameras not found in older generation of cameras but I'm looking at it in a bigger picture and overall abilities, the 6D comes short and is reflective in the its launch pricing structure. A 5D3 and 1Dx, now these cameras offer real qualitative upgrade over previous generation of Canon FF cameras such as the 5D2 and 1Ds2 & 1Ds3.


Simon Chan is off-line
18 June 2014 04:01
Chandos
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Merseyside
Liverpool

Quote from profilepictures


Have to say here, the 6d is a step up from the 5d2, and really the 5d original has a very limited usable ISO range ( suffering as it does with not only noise issues but also 'banding' in the noise pattern which makes it hard work to remove from a picture. It's not all things to all men, so doesn't do fast action too well and has limited focus points, but for difficult light conditions and general IQ, it's a bargain.




Yes basically what I have said except I would not consider it a real upgrade from the 5D2. That is the 5D3.


Profile Pictures is off-line
18 June 2014 04:31
profilepictures
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profilepictures
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Suffolk
Bury St Edmunds

Chandos, as you've said, we all have an opinion, but its useful to qualify that with some evidence of knowledge. I see more in the way of ad hominen pops at checker than I see qualified opinion. I'd also suggest checkers work reflects a more considered and tested impression of the 6d than your own. You're absolutely at odds with my impression of the 6d, simply put, I can take pictures with the 6 I couldn't have approached with the previously owned 5d and 5dmk2. Incidentally you won't find a single studio lighting shot in my portfolio and a large proportion shot in near darkness.


Neil Anderson is off-line
18 June 2014 04:49
stolenfaces
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stolenfaces
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London
West London

Quote from Chandos
If you already have a Canon FF dSLR I don't understand why anyone would choose to "upgrade" to a 6D unless you own the first generation 5D and you want a bit more res and better lowlight. The 6D is the current Canon entry level for people moving into FF and despite improve AF I still don't rate it as a better camera than the 5D2 or 1Ds1 & 1Ds2.



Clearly he has a Nikon, so this discussion of Canon FF cameras isn't really much use (although quite amusing to people with D800s or D610s I expect)
Like any dealer he was watching for the card that is so high and wild he'll never need to deal another...


Simon Chan is off-line
18 June 2014 05:10
Chandos
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Merseyside
Liverpool

Quote from profilepictures
Chandos, as you've said, we all have an opinion, but its useful to qualify that with some evidence of knowledge. I see more in the way of ad hominen pops at checker than I see qualified opinion. I'd also suggest checkers work reflects a more considered and tested impression of the 6d than your own. You're absolutely at odds with my impression of the 6d, simply put, I can take pictures with the 6 I couldn't have approached with the previously owned 5d and 5dmk2. Incidentally you won't find a single studio lighting shot in my portfolio and a large proportion shot in near darkness.



This is the same old rebuttal "let see you do better" phrase we see on internet discussion to undermine someone's opinion. Hey I don't need to be a chef to know what Chandos is a naughty person taste like or a carpenter to know what a badly made chair looks a feel. I don't know why you should take people's images they put in PS to qualify what they say as more credible. Redchecker has been taking pops at me over filmmaking gears too and there is nothing to say he is a qualified filmmaker at any level. However he is free to comment and I don't call into question about his work or lack of as a filmmaker.

FYI I'm only a casual model stills shooter and don't tend to put my commercial stuff on here for personal reasons, hence why I'm on a freebie account and always has.


Simon Chan is off-line
18 June 2014 05:20
Chandos
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Merseyside
Liverpool

Quote from profilepictures
Chandos, as you've said, we all have an opinion, but its useful to qualify that with some evidence of knowledge. I see more in the way of ad hominen pops at checker than I see qualified opinion. I'd also suggest checkers work reflects a more considered and tested impression of the 6d than your own. You're absolutely at odds with my impression of the 6d, simply put, I can take pictures with the 6 I couldn't have approached with the previously owned 5d and 5dmk2. Incidentally you won't find a single studio lighting shot in my portfolio and a large proportion shot in near darkness.



Yes quite true. Comments have deviated. It seems some people have invested in a camera they feel passionate about.



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