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GOODBYE BENN

Paul Hodson is off-line
17 March 2014 13:37
mph
Photographer
mph
Location
United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from carshaltonkev[/author



WHAT ABOUT THE POLL TAX RED CHECKER???!!! WAS THAT FAIR???!!!








Yes
Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk


Kevin W is off-lineSilver Member
17 March 2014 13:51
carshaltonkev
Photographer
carshaltonkev
Location
United Kingdom
London
Carshalton / Surrey / Greater London

Quote from mph
Yes



I agree, very fair for the rich living in big houses! Not so fair for everybody else!

Not so fair for those like me, who were fined for non payment, even though I had paid, because my local council was in such a mess trying to cope with collecting it. Hardly surprising there were riots. There is only so much injustice that people can swallow.

As in life, so in a game of hazard, skill will make something of the worst of throws.


Kevin W is off-lineSilver Member
17 March 2014 14:19
carshaltonkev
Photographer
carshaltonkev
Location
United Kingdom
London
Carshalton / Surrey / Greater London

Whenever I read somebody praising Thatcher on these forums I get carried away. Apologies it you find this rather boring, but I am not prepared to just sit here and say nothing. After this I will give it a rest.

Here are 42 good reasons not to like Thatcher-

1. She supported the retention of capital punishment
2. She destroyed the country's manufacturing industry
3. She voted against the relaxation of divorce laws
4. She abolished free milk for schoolchildren
5. She supported more freedom for business (and look how that turned out)
6. She gained support from the National Front in the 1979 election by pandering to the fears of immigration
7. She gerrymandered local authorities by forcing through council house sales, at the same time preventing councils from spending the money they got for selling houses on building new houses (spending on social housing dropped by 67% in her premiership)
8. She was responsible for 3.6 million unemployed - the highest figure and the highest proportion of the workforce in history and three times the previous government. Massaging of the figures means that the figure was closer to 5 million
9. She ignored intelligence about Argentinian preparations for the invasion of the Falkland Islands and scrapped the only Royal Navy presence in the islands
10. The poll tax
11. She presided over the closure of 150 coal mines; we are now crippled by the cost of energy, having to import expensive coal from abroad
12. She compared her "fight" against the miners to the Falklands War
13. She privatised state monopolies and created the corporate greed culture that we've been railing against for the last 5 years
14. She introduced the gradual privatisation of the NHS
15. She introduced financial deregulation in a way that turned city institutions into avaricious money pits
16. She pioneered the unfailing adoration and unquestioning support of the USA
17. She allowed the US to place nuclear missiles on UK soil, under US control
18. Section 28
19. She opposed anti-apartheid sanctions against South Africa and described Nelson Mandela as "that grubby little terrorist"
20. She support the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia and sent the SAS to train their soldiers
21. She allowed the US to bomb Libya in 1986, against the wishes of more than 2/3 of the population
22. She opposed the reunification of Germany
23. She invented Quangos
24. She increased VAT from 8% to 17.5%
25. She had the lowest approval rating of any post-war Prime Minister
26. Her post-PM job? Consultant to Philip Morris tobacco at $250,000 a year, plus $50,000 per speech
27. The Al Yamamah contract
28. She opposed the indictment of Chile's General Pinochet
29. Social unrest under her leadership was higher than at any time since the General Strike
30. She presided over interest rates increasing to 15%
31. BSE
32. She presided over 2 million manufacturing job losses in the 79-81 recession
33. She opposed the inclusion of Eire in the Northern Ireland peace process
34. She supported sanctions-busting arms deals with South Africa
35. Cecil Parkinson, Alan Clark, David Mellor, Jeffrey Archer, Jonathan Aitkin
36. Crime rates doubled under Thatcher
37. Black Wednesday – Britain withdraws from the ERM and the pound is devalued. Cost to Britain - £3.5 billion; profit for George Soros - £1 billion
38. Poverty doubled while she opposed a minimum wage
39. She privatised public services, claiming at the time it would increase public ownership. Most are now owned either by foreign governments (EDF) or major investment houses. The profits don’t now accrue to the taxpayer, but to foreign or institutional shareholders.
40. She cut 75% of funding to museums, galleries and other sources of education
41. In the Thatcher years the top 10% of earners received almost 50% of the tax remissions
42. 21.9% inflation
As in life, so in a game of hazard, skill will make something of the worst of throws.


Paul Hodson is off-line
17 March 2014 14:34
mph
Photographer
mph
Location
United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from carshaltonkev
I agree, very fair for the rich living in big houses! Not so fair for everybody else!

Not so fair for those like me, who were fined for non payment, even though I had paid, because my local council was in such a mess trying to cope with collecting it. Hardly surprising there were riots. There is only so much injustice that people can swallow.



Why incidentally is it fair that four well paid people living in a small house pay less in council tax than one elderly person in a larger house?


The incompetence of your council employees is hardly a reason to hate Thatcher!
Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk


Paul Hodson is off-line
17 March 2014 14:40
mph
Photographer
mph
Location
United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from carshaltonkev
Whenever I read somebody praising Thatcher on these forums I get carried away. Apologies it you find this rather boring, but I am not prepared to just sit here and say nothing. After this I will give it a rest. Here are 42 good reasons not to like Thatcher




I really can't be bothered going through this load of tripe - but this one struck me.

"She invented Quangos"

Quote from that Thatcher loving paper - the Guardian - re quangos

"Margaret Thatcher, came to power in 1979 determined to slaughter many of them, but – as in much else – found it hard even for her formidable willpower to achieve."

Criticise her by all means for failing - but not for inventing them!

Still  laugh
Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk


Salacious Art is off-line
17 March 2014 14:58
pentax5AC
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
East Yorkshire
Bridlington

Quote from stolenfaces


As you're probably a bit thick, I should point out that comment was an elitist mix of irony and sarcasm ]
Have you noticed how genuinely creative people tend to be leftist / anti-establishment ? Is your profile ironic ?



No, not ironic. I think real irony, Neil, is when people like you, keen to participate in adult debates lack the maturity and intelligence to argue a point rationally without resorting to infantile personal insults.
Let me know when you have something valid and remotely intelligent to say, and I willl be happy to respond.




Tony Stephenson is off-line
18 March 2014 03:18
tonycsm
Photographer
tonycsm
Location
United Kingdom
East Yorkshire
Driffield

Quote from carshaltonkev
Whenever I read somebody praising Thatcher on these forums I get carried away. Apologies it you find this rather boring, but I am not prepared to just sit here and say nothing. After this I will give it a rest. Here are 42 good reasons not to like Thatcher- 1. She supported the retention of capital punishment 2. She destroyed the country's manufacturing industry 3. She voted against the relaxation of divorce laws 4. She abolished free milk for schoolchildren 5. She supported more freedom for business (and look how that turned out) 6. She gained support from the National Front in the 1979 election by pandering to the fears of immigration 7. She gerrymandered local authorities by forcing through council house sales, at the same time preventing councils from spending the money they got for selling houses on building new houses (spending on social housing dropped by 67% in her premiership) 8. She was responsible for 3.6 million unemployed - the highest figure and the highest proportion of the workforce in history and three times the previous government. Massaging of the figures means that the figure was closer to 5 million 9. She ignored intelligence about Argentinian preparations for the invasion of the Falkland Islands and scrapped the only Royal Navy presence in the islands 10. The poll tax 11. She presided over the closure of 150 coal mines; we are now crippled by the cost of energy, having to import expensive coal from abroad 12. She compared her "fight" against the miners to the Falklands War 13. She privatised state monopolies and created the corporate greed culture that we've been railing against for the last 5 years 14. She introduced the gradual privatisation of the NHS 15. She introduced financial deregulation in a way that turned city institutions into avaricious money pits 16. She pioneered the unfailing adoration and unquestioning support of the USA 17. She allowed the US to place nuclear missiles on UK soil, under US control 18. Section 28 19. She opposed anti-apartheid sanctions against South Africa and described Nelson Mandela as "that grubby little terrorist" 20. She support the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia and sent the SAS to train their soldiers 21. She allowed the US to bomb Libya in 1986, against the wishes of more than 2/3 of the population 22. She opposed the reunification of Germany 23. She invented Quangos 24. She increased VAT from 8% to 17.5% 25. She had the lowest approval rating of any post-war Prime Minister 26. Her post-PM job? Consultant to Philip Morris tobacco at $250,000 a year, plus $50,000 per speech 27. The Al Yamamah contract 28. She opposed the indictment of Chile's General Pinochet 29. Social unrest under her leadership was higher than at any time since the General Strike 30. She presided over interest rates increasing to 15% 31. BSE 32. She presided over 2 million manufacturing job losses in the 79-81 recession 33. She opposed the inclusion of Eire in the Northern Ireland peace process 34. She supported sanctions-busting arms deals with South Africa 35. Cecil Parkinson, Alan Clark, David Mellor, Jeffrey Archer, Jonathan Aitkin 36. Crime rates doubled under Thatcher 37. Black Wednesday – Britain withdraws from the ERM and the pound is devalued. Cost to Britain - £3.5 billion; profit for George Soros - £1 billion 38. Poverty doubled while she opposed a minimum wage 39. She privatised public services, claiming at the time it would increase public ownership. Most are now owned either by foreign governments (EDF) or major investment houses. The profits don’t now accrue to the taxpayer, but to foreign or institutional shareholders. 40. She cut 75% of funding to museums, galleries and other sources of education 41. In the Thatcher years the top 10% of earners received almost 50% of the tax remissions 42. 21.9% inflation



So, I take it you were't a big fan of hers then?
www.le-femme.co.uk


Bob is off-linePlatinum Member
18 March 2014 06:04
Bob
Photographer
Bob
Location
United Kingdom
Devon
Honiton

Quote from carshaltonkev
Whenever I read somebody praising Thatcher on these forums I get carried away. Apologies it you find this rather boring, but I am not prepared to just sit here and say nothing. After this I will give it a rest. Here are 42 good reasons not to like Thatcher- 1. She supported the retention of capital punishment 2. She destroyed the country's manufacturing industry 3. She voted against the relaxation of divorce laws 4. She abolished free milk for schoolchildren 5. She supported more freedom for business (and look how that turned out) 6. She gained support from the National Front in the 1979 election by pandering to the fears of immigration 7. She gerrymandered local authorities by forcing through council house sales, at the same time preventing councils from spending the money they got for selling houses on building new houses (spending on social housing dropped by 67% in her premiership) 8. She was responsible for 3.6 million unemployed - the highest figure and the highest proportion of the workforce in history and three times the previous government. Massaging of the figures means that the figure was closer to 5 million 9. She ignored intelligence about Argentinian preparations for the invasion of the Falkland Islands and scrapped the only Royal Navy presence in the islands 10. The poll tax 11. She presided over the closure of 150 coal mines; we are now crippled by the cost of energy, having to import expensive coal from abroad 12. She compared her "fight" against the miners to the Falklands War 13. She privatised state monopolies and created the corporate greed culture that we've been railing against for the last 5 years 14. She introduced the gradual privatisation of the NHS 15. She introduced financial deregulation in a way that turned city institutions into avaricious money pits 16. She pioneered the unfailing adoration and unquestioning support of the USA 17. She allowed the US to place nuclear missiles on UK soil, under US control 18. Section 28 19. She opposed anti-apartheid sanctions against South Africa and described Nelson Mandela as "that grubby little terrorist" 20. She support the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia and sent the SAS to train their soldiers 21. She allowed the US to bomb Libya in 1986, against the wishes of more than 2/3 of the population 22. She opposed the reunification of Germany 23. She invented Quangos 24. She increased VAT from 8% to 17.5% 25. She had the lowest approval rating of any post-war Prime Minister 26. Her post-PM job? Consultant to Philip Morris tobacco at $250,000 a year, plus $50,000 per speech 27. The Al Yamamah contract 28. She opposed the indictment of Chile's General Pinochet 29. Social unrest under her leadership was higher than at any time since the General Strike 30. She presided over interest rates increasing to 15% 31. BSE 32. She presided over 2 million manufacturing job losses in the 79-81 recession 33. She opposed the inclusion of Eire in the Northern Ireland peace process 34. She supported sanctions-busting arms deals with South Africa 35. Cecil Parkinson, Alan Clark, David Mellor, Jeffrey Archer, Jonathan Aitkin 36. Crime rates doubled under Thatcher 37. Black Wednesday – Britain withdraws from the ERM and the pound is devalued. Cost to Britain - £3.5 billion; profit for George Soros - £1 billion 38. Poverty doubled while she opposed a minimum wage 39. She privatised public services, claiming at the time it would increase public ownership. Most are now owned either by foreign governments (EDF) or major investment houses. The profits don’t now accrue to the taxpayer, but to foreign or institutional shareholders. 40. She cut 75% of funding to museums, galleries and other sources of education 41. In the Thatcher years the top 10% of earners received almost 50% of the tax remissions 42. 21.9% inflation


Feed enough lies and half-truths to a fool and they are bound to regurgitate.
Bob


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
18 March 2014 06:36
RedChecker
Photographer
RedChecker
Location
United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

Quote from mph
Yes



+1

A house with lots of adults in it is going to use more services than a house with a single adult in (regardless of whether or not it's a bungalow or mansion) so why should the household with less people be penalised.  I think the poll tax was the fairest tax system this country had seen, unless you're lazy scum who congregate in squalor under one roof.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


OldMaster is off-line
18 March 2014 08:38
OldMaster
Photographer
OldMaster
Location
United Kingdom
Hertfordshire
Harpenden

As most on here are reactionary right wingers this post was always going to be controversial.

Benn was a true Socialist and anti war campaigner, much of his earlier life supporting the anti nuclear war race. He was a man of principle and true to himself until the end. I heard him speak in Trafalgar Square at the first Gulf War demonstration, a man so unlike Blair who spent most of his time up the second Bush's ar*e!

When you compare that with the pro apartheid/anti ANC stance of Thatcher, the Falklands War used to win an election, her friendship with fascist dictators, the destruction of whole working class communities and the antagonistic approach to solving the Irish crisis..(voice overs for Adams..you couldn't make it up)not to mention the start of the sell off of this country and the creation of money being the only god, then Yes, I can wholly understand the somewhat celebratory nature after Thatcher's demise. Can't compete with CarshaltonKev here..well done, and all so true!!!

Where she did succeed, supported by the tabloids, was creating the first generation that believed in all this crap, a generation who worship celebrities and determine success by how wealthy one is. Certainly her death achieved little to correct any of this but Tony Benn's death has left a space where morality and ethics used to be.

With luck his legacy will be absorbed into the Milliband cabinet as they move forward to form our next Government, probably in alliance with the Liberals.

Socialist and proud of it



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