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Women Hit Hardest of all by Osborne

Neil Anderson is off-line
09 March 2014 08:58
stolenfaces
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Quote from tonycsm
I was sad to see the utilities removed from state ownership and put into private ownership, but what was the alternative?



Thatcher had to break the stranglehold of the Soviet backed militant unions which were effectively driving the grossly over-manned industries and the country into the ground with their incessant strikes, militant actions and unrealistic demands.



It would have been far better today for the utilities to be in public ownership though it wouldn't have guaranteed services would have been cheaper but, the one good thing to come out of it has been the continuity of services provided by the various private companies...unlike when in state ownership with strikes and cuts in services in some form or other being an almost daily occurrence..



That was indeed the ugly face of Socialism - anyone who lived through the 60's - early 80's period will know exactly what I mean.






Either you are living some sort of bad dream or you are deliberately re-writing history. List some of these strikes (and the Soviet backed unions).
Thatcher sold the utilities off to make money, and give it to the rich in tax cuts as she was ideologically opposed to the efficient use of resources. (The only notable state owned industry which might vaguely fit your scenario would be the Coal Industry which Thatcher closed down rather than sold off.)

Although she was happy to sell these industry's off for a pittance, even she wouldn't sell Royal Mail, which this government gave away last year.
Like any dealer he was watching for the card that is so high and wild he'll never need to deal another...


Tony Stephenson is off-line
09 March 2014 09:46
tonycsm
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tonycsm
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Driffield

Quote from stolenfaces
Either you are living some sort of bad dream or you are deliberately re-writing history. List some of these strikes (and the Soviet backed unions). Thatcher sold the utilities off to make money, and give it to the rich in tax cuts as she was ideologically opposed to the efficient use of resources. (The only notable state owned industry which might vaguely fit your scenario would be the Coal Industry which Thatcher closed down rather than sold off.) Although she was happy to sell these industry's off for a pittance, even she wouldn't sell Royal Mail, which this government gave away last year.



Were you actually around and old enough to experience what was happening at that time? 
www.le-femme.co.uk


Tony Stephenson is off-line
09 March 2014 09:46
tonycsm
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tonycsm
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Driffield

Quote from stolenfaces
Either you are living some sort of bad dream or you are deliberately re-writing history. List some of these strikes (and the Soviet backed unions). Thatcher sold the utilities off to make money, and give it to the rich in tax cuts as she was ideologically opposed to the efficient use of resources. (The only notable state owned industry which might vaguely fit your scenario would be the Coal Industry which Thatcher closed down rather than sold off.) Although she was happy to sell these industry's off for a pittance, even she wouldn't sell Royal Mail, which this government gave away last year.



Were you actually around and old enough to appreciate what was happening at that time? 
www.le-femme.co.uk


Neil Anderson is off-line
09 March 2014 09:55
stolenfaces
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stolenfaces
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Quote from tonycsm
Were you actually around and old enough to appreciate what was happening at that time? 



Yes - that's why I know that what you say is not the reality - specify the strikes that you claim happened in the industries in public ownership.
It should be easy enough if you are painting a truthful picture.

Surely the offical right-wing view of the success of companies like British Gas, Bt, SSE (all the electricity companies apart from SSE are now owned by foreign companies like Electricite De France, I think the Water Companies too) is that the management weren't paid a competitive (ie obscene) wage when they were in public ownership. No-one any good can be expected to get out of bed for less that £4M a year plus a few million in bonus, apparently.
Like any dealer he was watching for the card that is so high and wild he'll never need to deal another...


Tony Stephenson is off-line
09 March 2014 15:54
tonycsm
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tonycsm
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Driffield

Quote from stolenfaces
Yes - that's why I know that what you say is not the reality - specify the strikes that you claim happened in the industries in public ownership. It should be easy enough if you are painting a truthful picture. .



Careful, you appear to be suffering from what is known as selective amnesia!

Now let's see if we can address this issue to help you get back some of your lost memory.

1957 - 8.4 million working days lost through industrial action.

Average annual number of working days lost during 50's and 60's - 3.6 million

1979 - the pinacle of union madness.... The Winter of Discontent....29.5 million working days lost through strike action. This figure was higher than the working days lost during the whole of the miner's strike which was 27.1 million!

Earlier we had the three day week with power cuts due to the action of the NUM....During the 1970's, working days lost through strike action averaged over 12 million per year. 

I could go on but that is enough for now for you to perhaps regain a little of your lost memory!



www.le-femme.co.uk


Neil Anderson is off-line
09 March 2014 16:27
stolenfaces
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stolenfaces
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London
West London

Quote from tonycsm
Careful, you appear to be suffering from what is known as selective amnesia!



Now let's see if we can address this issue to help you get back some of your lost memory.



1957 - 8.4 million working days lost through industrial action.



Average annual number of working days lost during 50's and 60's - 3.6 million



1979 - the pinacle of union madness.... The Winter of Discontent....29.5 million working days lost through strike action. This figure was higher than the working days lost during the whole of the miner's strike which was 27.1 million!



Earlier we had the three day week with power cuts due to the action of the NUM....During the 1970's, working days lost through strike action averaged over 12 million per year. 



I could go on but that is enough for now for you to perhaps regain a little of your lost memory!










These strikes were not in the nationalised industries - your argument is just hot air.

List the strikes in the industries that were privatised that you claimed have reduced since privatisation.

Huffing, puffing and lies typical of the right wing press and you.
So your argument boils down to 'Thatcher sold off the Energy, Water and Telecoms industries for a pittance as a reaction to the NUM and the strikers at British Leyland, Ford, Local Councils , the Fire brigade, London Underground & British Rail (note that British Rail was sold off by Major not Thatcher)' does it ?
Or 'as a reaction to widespread strikes in 1957 the Conservative government responded by giving away nationalised industries, 30 years later'

And just to put your other stats in context, Thatcher increased the number of people out of work from 1 million in 1979 (Labour isn't working) to around 4 Million, so by the mid eighties (200 x 3 Million =) 600 Million extra work days were being lost per year due to her government's policies.
Like any dealer he was watching for the card that is so high and wild he'll never need to deal another...


Tony Stephenson is off-line
09 March 2014 19:12
tonycsm
Photographer
tonycsm
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East Yorkshire
Driffield

Quote from stolenfaces
These strikes were not in the nationalised industries - your argument is just hot air. List the strikes in the industries that were privatised that you claimed have reduced since privatisation. Huffing, puffing and lies typical of the right wing press and you. So your argument boils down to 'Thatcher sold off the Energy, Water and Telecoms industries for a pittance as a reaction to the NUM and the strikers at British Leyland, Ford, Local Councils , the Fire brigade, London Underground & British Rail (note that British Rail was sold off by Major not Thatcher)' does it ? Or 'as a reaction to widespread strikes in 1957 the Conservative government responded by giving away nationalised industries, 30 years later' And just to put your other stats in context, Thatcher increased the number of people out of work from 1 million in 1979 (Labour isn't working) to around 4 Million, so by the mid eighties (200 x 3 Million =) 600 Million extra work days were being lost per year due to her government's policies.



Are you saying that the unions weren't militant and active in the industries sold off or closed during the Thatcher period?

ALL the nationalised industries were grossly overmanned and inefficient - run by unions which were unwilling to allow management to modernise and cut staff to realistic levels to make them prifitable and it was costing the taxpayer huge sums just to keep these industrial dinosaurs running. 

If they could have been modernised and run efficiently and unions hadn't been so militant, then they would probably be still in public ownership today!

Before Thatcher came along, it wasn't the elected government of the day that was running the country, it was the left wing union bosses!

You might like to look up the name Jack Jones...the trades union supremo.. judged as a result of a gallup pole in 1974 to be the most powerful person in Britain..above the Prime Minister....
Who it now appears is alleged by M15 to have been passing secret government plans to the Russians during his time in office! Nice people those trades union bosses!

Of course you won't remember those things due to your selective amnesia!
www.le-femme.co.uk


 jivago Photographic is off-line
09 March 2014 20:47
jivago
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jivago
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Highland
Highlands & Cheshire

Quote from tonycsm
Are you saying that the unions weren't militant and active in the industries sold off or closed during the Thatcher period?

ALL the nationalised industries were grossly overmanned and inefficient - run by unions which were unwilling to allow management to modernise and cut staff to realistic levels to make them prifitable and it was costing the taxpayer huge sums just to keep these industrial dinosaurs running. 

If they could have been modernised and run efficiently and unions hadn't been so militant, then they would probably be still in public ownership today!

Before Thatcher came along, it wasn't the elected government of the day that was running the country, it was the left wing union bosses!

You might like to look up the name Jack Jones...the trades union supremo.. judged as a result of a gallup pole in 1974 to be the most powerful person in Britain..above the Prime Minister....
Who it now appears is alleged by M15 to have been passing secret government plans to the Russians during his time in office! Nice people those trades union bosses!

Of course you won't remember those things due to your selective amnesia!



IF any of that was true?? - It is all you ever refer to - Move on for God's sake!

This is 2014! -  And this thread is about  the pernicious effect of this Conservative Government, inimical to the interests of Women - Savvy Grandad?

http://www.jivagophoto.com/


Andy_B is off-lineSilver Member
09 March 2014 21:15
Andy_B
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Andy_B
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London

Quote from jivago
IF any of that was true?? - It is all you ever refer to - Move on for God's sake!

This is 2014! -  And this thread is about  the pernicious effect of this Conservative Government, inimical to the interests of Women - Savvy Grandad?




Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. - George Santayana

We've experimented with socialism before and it didn't work. Let's not make that same mistake again.


Colin H is off-lineSilver Member
10 March 2014 04:25
thelook
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thelook
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Berkshire


Based on the Tony and Gordon era, I can not disagree with this statement:
“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.
When the world whispers 'give up, a fool will say 'I'll give it one more try'.....



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