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Scottish referendum.

gerryquiff is off-lineSilver Member
16 February 2014 19:26
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Quote from Andy_B
And they will have a new currency!



Not the Euro ('cos Spain and Germany wouldn't let them join). Maybe they'll return to the 'groat'?



I think they've got it covered



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 jivago Photographic is off-line
16 February 2014 19:32
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Quote from SMILESPHOTO
Apparently it's been announced that an independent Scotland is likely to find it difficult to join the EU and this will put many voters off wanting independence. I would have thought that many would have found this a positive enticement!!



Maybe the Scots find the French far more open minded, cosmopolitian warm and welcoming than 'Lil Ingerlunders' ?

Puzzle though! -  If Scotland stays in the UK, then the 'Lil Ingerlunders' may drag her out of the European Union, when we have the UKIP (sorry conservative - It s so easy to get them mixed up) referendum. Scotland could end up in a Union containing the likes of Baron Von Osborne & the'Lil Ingerlunders' - But out of the European Union! sad

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Chrissie Red is off-line
16 February 2014 20:24
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Quote from gerryquiff
I think they've got it covered



haha thats the one!

I still think its cute when English models come up to Scotland and swoon over our crisp notes.. Imagine them collecting the "quids" on their tours!



Tony Stephenson is off-line
16 February 2014 20:28
tonycsm
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Quote from jivago
After that dull uniformed read, its no surprise at all that the Yes vote is rising........... "The Scottish National party (SNP) administration has already dismissed Osborne's speech as "bluff, bluster and bullying". Salmond will attack Osborne's stance when he speaks to the pro-independence Business for Scotland organisation. He said: "The reality is the pound is as much Scotland's as the rest of the UK. By suggesting otherwise, the Westminster establishment – Tories, Labour and Lib Dems – are reaping a backlash from the ordinary people of Scotland, who feel this is an attempt to bully Scotland ahead of the democratic choice we all look forward to this September. "I will be deconstructing the chancellor's ill-thought-out and misinformed intervention point by point, making clear why a currency union not only favours Scotland but is in the clear economic interests of the UK as well. "For example, the chancellor will have to explain exactly why he favours imposing almost £500m worth of higher transaction costs on UK businesses instead of entering a perfectly feasible sterling area with the rest of the UK's second biggest trading partner. "The Scottish government has welcomed the recent acknowledgement by the Treasury that it will remain legally liable for all debt issued by the UK government up to the point of independence, and we will continue to take the fair and reasonable position that an independent Scotland should finance a fair share of that. "However, the chancellor will have to wake up to the fact that he cannot lay claim to assets to which Scotland has a share – such as the Bank of England and the pound – and still expect an independent Scotland to meet a share of UK liabilities." He added: "These are just two examples of undemocratic and self-defeating positions being put forward by a Westminster establishment that continues to say whatever campaign rhetoric suits their cause before the referendum and highlights why they will smartly change their tune after it."



I'm neautral over whether Scotland stays part of the Union or not and good luck to them if they choose independence but are you seriously suggesting that the rUK and BoE should underwrite the economy of a newly independent Scotland (if the vote is YES of course)?

I think the people of the rUK might have something to say about that and it won't be what the Nationalists or the Scots want to hear.

The Nationalists or should we say Salmond and his moll got it completely wrong when they wrongly assumed that they could keep the pound as their currency until they could dump any links to the BoE just as they dumped the rUK. 

A currency union with rUK is just not going to happen as it would be far too risky and given that the SNP doesn't even have any credible policies or a Plan B regarding currency union of any kind, it would be foolish to even consider it.
It has nothing to do with bullying as claimed in the SNP bluster - it's Westminster protecting the interests of the people of the rUK and something that any sensible country's government would do under the circumstances. 

If I was a Scot with a mortgage, job, a pension, shares/investments etc right now and faced with making a lifechanging decision like this, I'd want the party which wants me to vote for them to come up with policies which prove that an independent Scotland would be making that decision based on a sound financial footing and proven policies and not just the dreams of disaffected SNP supporters.
No doubt at some point the EU will accept Scotland as an independent member country but it won't be overnight, so in the meantime where or who will Scotland borrow it's money from and at what cost to the Scottish taxpayer? 
Again, even if you shed the Westminster control over Scotland you are going to substitute one set of rulers with the EU who will probably make you pay a high price for being a member of their club so freedom often comes at a very high price.

Just my views of course.wink
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click_gotcha is off-line
17 February 2014 05:50
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Quote from tonycsm
I'm neautral over whether Scotland stays part of the Union or not and good luck to them if they choose independence but are you seriously suggesting that the rUK and BoE should underwrite the economy of a newly independent Scotland (if the vote is YES of course)?

I think the people of the rUK might have something to say about that and it won't be what the Nationalists or the Scots want to hear.

The Nationalists or should we say Salmond and his moll got it completely wrong when they wrongly assumed that they could keep the pound as their currency until they could dump any links to the BoE just as they dumped the rUK. 

A currency union with rUK is just not going to happen as it would be far too risky and given that the SNP doesn't even have any credible policies or a Plan B regarding currency union of any kind, it would be foolish to even consider it.
It has nothing to do with bullying as claimed in the SNP bluster - it's Westminster protecting the interests of the people of the rUK and something that any sensible country's government would do under the circumstances. 

If I was a Scot with a mortgage, job, a pension, shares/investments etc right now and faced with making a lifechanging decision like this, I'd want the party which wants me to vote for them to come up with policies which prove that an independent Scotland would be making that decision based on a sound financial footing and proven policies and not just the dreams of disaffected SNP supporters.
No doubt at some point the EU will accept Scotland as an independent member country but it won't be overnight, so in the meantime where or who will Scotland borrow it's money from and at what cost to the Scottish taxpayer? 
Again, even if you shed the Westminster control over Scotland you are going to substitute one set of rulers with the EU who will probably make you pay a high price for being a member of their club so freedom often comes at a very high price.

Just my views of course.wink



We're not going to become independent overnight, it will take 2 years of negotiations with rUK and we will still be in the EU during those 2 years.   So, plenty of time to negotiate terms with the EU too.   The currency remains to be seen but is in no way a deal breaker.   I think it's interesting that George Osborne delivered his "You're not using the £" speech but then refused to answer any questions afterwards and instead sneaked out a side door into a waiting car to the airport.  If he was so confident in his polcy why didn't he field any questions about it?  I'm pretty sure many businnes in England Wales and NI would want to ask him about the cost of exchanging currency that they will have to pay if Scotland doesn't use the £.



Jim Meek is off-line
17 February 2014 06:15
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just a thought. If the UK is a member of the EU and Scotland will need to re-apply for membership does this mean England, Wales and Northern Ireland will also need to re-apply and if not why not?


Neil Anderson is off-line
17 February 2014 06:17
stolenfaces
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But maybe without Scottish yes votes the English will vote to leave the EU so under Salmon's plan this would leave Scotland in the EU using the pound.
Surely it would make more sense for their currency to be controlled by Berlin than London.
Or in view of the importance of oil and gas which are priced in dollars, they would be better off with the dollar.
Like any dealer he was watching for the card that is so high and wild he'll never need to deal another...


Tony Stephenson is off-line
17 February 2014 08:15
tonycsm
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Quote from stolenfaces
But maybe without Scottish yes votes the English will vote to leave the EU so under Salmon's plan this would leave Scotland in the EU using the pound. Surely it would make more sense for their currency to be controlled by Berlin than London. Or in view of the importance of oil and gas which are priced in dollars, they would be better off with the dollar.



Good argument!cheeky

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click_gotcha is off-line
17 February 2014 08:21
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Quote from stolenfaces
But maybe without Scottish yes votes the English will vote to leave the EU so under Salmon's plan this would leave Scotland in the EU using the pound. Surely it would make more sense for their currency to be controlled by Berlin than London. Or in view of the importance of oil and gas which are priced in dollars, they would be better off with the dollar.



On the other hand we could vote no and be dragged out of the EU when the voters of England vote to leave it in 2017.

You could argue that the only way for Scotland to remain in the EU is to vote Yes in the independence referendum.



Tony Stephenson is off-line
17 February 2014 08:33
tonycsm
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Quote from click_gotcha
We're not going to become independent overnight, it will take 2 years of negotiations with rUK and we will still be in the EU during those 2 years.   So, plenty of time to negotiate terms with the EU too.   The currency remains to be seen but is in no way a deal breaker.   I think it's interesting that George Osborne delivered his "You're not using the £" speech but then refused to answer any questions afterwards and instead sneaked out a side door into a waiting car to the airport.  If he was so confident in his polcy why didn't he field any questions about it?  I'm pretty sure many businnes in England Wales and NI would want to ask him about the cost of exchanging currency that they will have to pay if Scotland doesn't use the £.




Why should Osborne go into details...he simply said NO currency union. That's the position of all the parties withing the rest of rUK. It's up to the SNP to put forward valid reasons why there should be a currency union...up to now they've not proffered one.

The arguments about rises in costs due to currency exchanges is far more overshadowed by the risks of a currency union with a newly independent country which doesn't even have a Plan B let alone viable fiscal policies.

If I'm not mistaken, the SNP have set the timetable for around 18 months after a potential YES vote for full independence... it will take far longer than that even to join the EU...there will be a few countries like Spain which will cause problems as Spain alone has two regions with similar aspirations as do the SNP so Spain and the likes are not going to sit idly by and let Scotland straight in!

I'm afraid your first minister is deluded if he thinks differently.

If Scotland really wants monetary union with the rUK, then let them go off, do their own thing and if successful, then maybe let them join in a monetary union with rUK but why should the rest of the UK have to underwrite Scotland's economy after they have effectively dumped the UK union?

www.le-femme.co.uk



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