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Pocketwizards and the 6d 5dmkIII and 1DX debacle..

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Graham is off-lineSilver Member
21 January 2014 14:30
smooth_image
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So I emailed pocketwizard to ask why these canon users are still awaiting firmware upgrades so the they have full TTL like the rest of the canon range. (I use the pocketwizards with my 5d mk1 and 7d effortlessly. But I am itching to get to work with my 6d and it seems pocketwizard are absolutely stumped by these cameras. So far we have manual use, nothing more.

even now all I am getting is 'we are working hard on this' but canon changed the way they communicate up through the hot shoe with the 6D and since they dont help us with any sort of communications we have to spend time reversing every signal that comes up through the shoe and write new code for it'  They have been doing that since before June last year !

It seems they cannot simply copy what canon have done as they are based in the usa and subject to stringent rules, whereas rival manufacturers based in china can simply copy the canon technology and they work flawlessly.

Is anyone else in this position with one of these 3 cameras ? Most frustrating.

Cheers

Graham


'You hold onto your tongue, and I will hold onto my patience...'


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
21 January 2014 17:26
RedChecker
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Yep it's annoying, but thankfully I don't generally use TTL anyway and have two other bodies that work fine should I feel the need to use it.

It has ALWAYS been the way that all third party manufacturers have to reverse engineer the technology, and yes, patents/copyright is in place in most of the world (except China) so unless you buy that cheap stuff you're buggered.

There is of course the new Canon wireless TTL system, it does seem something of a coincidence that as that comes out the new cameras also have new code which mucks up the third party stuff.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
21 January 2014 17:39
RedChecker
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The thing I find clever (in a scary way) is that Canon have engineered their TTL protocol in such a way that even 20+ years after the introduction of the EOS system they're still able to tweak the signals and confuse people trying to reverse engineer it while still ensuring compatibility for in-house gear,

I get the impression they did drop the ball with the 200mm f2 L though as that had problems with the 5D MK 3 iirc.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Bill_M is off-line
05 February 2014 04:48
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It has always been the same. In the pre-digital days I had Canon bodies and Sigma lenses. Then when the 300D, the first affordable DSLR, came out I bought it. My Sigma lenses, which had worked perfectly with my film bodies, would not work with the digital ones. Sigma could not update them to work. There is a lot of secret code which Canon do not disclose and which is difficult or impossible to reverse engineer, so there is never any guarantee that third part accessories will work with new Canon bodies.


Phil Moto is off-lineSilver Member
05 February 2014 05:11
xtiggerx
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Just read this Canon related issues....its well over my head ,i admit im not technically aware as many on PS are,but a manufacturer preventing use of third party equipment is surely short sighted....there are so many other quality producers of DSLR's why dont you all canon disgruntled owners sell your gear and buy another make? people power....and no i dont own a nikon....
Think this post will generate alot of flak towards me but its just a comment.If your not happy with a product...change it......


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
05 February 2014 05:37
RedChecker
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Quote from xtiggerx
Just read this Canon related issues....its well over my head ,i admit im not technically aware as many on PS are,but a manufacturer preventing use of third party equipment is surely short sighted....there are so many other quality producers of DSLR's why dont you all canon disgruntled owners sell your gear and buy another make? people power....and no i dont own a nikon.... Think this post will generate alot of flak towards me but its just a comment.If your not happy with a product...change it......



It's not short sighted at all, they've just introduced their own new wireless trigger system and many will opt for buying that (at great expense).

Which leads onto the next point about changing.... many people who are keen photographers (wither amateur or professional) have invested vast sums of money (tens of thousands in some cases) into not only bodies but lenses and other make-specific accessories and to buy new again would be crippling for most.  It's not just financial viability though that would prevent this, many like a particular system because of how it works or feels and changing may not be what they want, besides ALL systems have their cons as well as pros and this is just one of Canon's.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Phil Moto is off-lineSilver Member
05 February 2014 06:20
xtiggerx
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xtiggerx
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Doncaster

Hello RC...
"Which leads onto the next point about changing.... many people who are keen photographers (wither amateur or professional) have invested vast sums of money (tens of thousands in some cases) into not only bodies but lenses and other make-specific accessories and to buy new again would be crippling for most. It's not just financial viability though that would prevent this, many like a particular system because of how it works or feels and changing may not be what they want, besides ALL systems have their cons as well as pros and this is just one of Canon's."

thanks for a logical reply,yes i see this as being a reason to not change,but why do makers do this?,if they lowered the price of accessories they would make the money as they have a good owner base.Im looking to buy a flash but the manufacturers model is just too expensive so looking at Metz unit.seems ludicous that i have to buy a makers flash unit costing a third of the price i paid for the camera..which id use on only a few occasions..but thats life...


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
05 February 2014 06:34
RedChecker
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RedChecker
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Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

By lowering the price or endorsing third party equipment you are effectively weakening your brand position.

If you take the IBM PC for example, clones in all shapes/sizes/specs & prices were made and eventually IBM themselves were forced out of the market. If you look at Apple on the other hand, they've kept their main product line very strictly controlled, especially in making clones almost impossible to be a feasible business option and as such they have not only a strong brand but also profits that come with it.

There is also the monstrous sums of money poured into R&D with these companies and if some of your products have a technical edge over a competitor it makes sense to keep it a closely guarded secret. Copyrights & patents on software/code also make sharing/licensing technologies that extra bit more complicated.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Christopher Vian-Smith is off-lineSilver Member
14 February 2014 16:08
ChrisVS
Photographer
ChrisVS
Location
United Kingdom
London
London

Quote from smooth_image
So I emailed pocketwizard to ask why these canon users are still awaiting firmware upgrades so the they have full TTL like the rest of the canon range. (I use the pocketwizards with my 5d mk1 and 7d effortlessly. But I am itching to get to work with my 6d and it seems pocketwizard are absolutely stumped by these cameras. So far we have manual use, nothing more.

even now all I am getting is 'we are working hard on this' but canon changed the way they communicate up through the hot shoe with the 6D and since they dont help us with any sort of communications we have to spend time reversing every signal that comes up through the shoe and write new code for it'  They have been doing that since before June last year !

It seems they cannot simply copy what canon have done as they are based in the usa and subject to stringent rules, whereas rival manufacturers based in china can simply copy the canon technology and they work flawlessly.

Is anyone else in this position with one of these 3 cameras ? Most frustrating.

Cheers

Graham





Pardon me for being iggorunt, but are you using the Pocket Wizards to fire the camera shutter, or merely mounting them on the camera's hot-shoe to fire remote flash? If the latter, it's put me right off buying the 6d....
www.chrisvs.com


HowardJ is off-line
14 February 2014 16:15
HowardJ
Photographer
HowardJ
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Surrey
West Midlands

Does anyone if ishoot wireless triggers are available in the UK?

They look cool but I think they work on the same frequency as DECT phones so probably aren't legal for use in the UK.



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