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Mark Duggan - Lawful killing

Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
09 January 2014 06:47
RedChecker
Photographer
RedChecker
Location
United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

Quote from JadedRed
The fact way changed the story over and over. The witnesses all disagreeing with the police's description of events.



There was an interesting documentary on TV a couple of years ago regarding whitness accuracy and how something out of the blue can cause confusion when recalling what happened.  They even performed an elaborate heist with guns being fired (while the witnesses were watching) and the variations in recollection of what happened varied wildly.

It may well be that tests have proven that if you have a rough idea of what was going on (as the police at the scene did) then their version of events is statistically more likely to be correct in comparison to those who were mere bystanders at the scene.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Tony Stephenson is off-line
09 January 2014 11:32
tonycsm
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tonycsm
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East Yorkshire
Driffield

Quote from JadedRed
The fact way changed the story over and over. The witnesses all disagreeing with the police's description of events. The people involved questioning the investigation.

It seems like whenever we get police killling someone or some other terrible thing the result is always "no, it's okay, we're not evil, we're just really incompetent". And I'm not sure that is much more reassuring.



Agreed!


www.le-femme.co.uk


Wilko is off-line
09 January 2014 13:01
tripod
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Derbyshire
Derby

If any good has come of this, it's that there's now 1 less scumbag on the streets.


OldMaster is off-line
09 January 2014 13:49
OldMaster
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OldMaster
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Hertfordshire
Harpenden

Judge, opinion and justice served out by forum..as usual. Guess we can all wait for the tabloids to tell us the real truth about the trial!

How many on here were in the court then? That's what I thought!

Its clear the victim, in his aunt's own words apparently, was no angel but what is also clear is that the gun found by the police was some 20ft away. These are recorded facts. The unlawful killing verdict is perhaps questionable as he was unarmed when shot.

What I do respect is his remaining family requesting there be no retaliation or reaction on the street and I understand they will be going for appeal through the justice system..a brave venture for those that perhaps have not come from the higher socio-economic groups.

What it highlights again for me is that regardless of the police action in this particular case is that this country as a society is prepared to accept the existence of under classes, often parentless or one remaining parent families living with virtually no chance of ever finding "work" and probably been surviving on benefits for two to three generations. Can one wonder why they might create their own society within these confines.

Some may consider the establishment just popping along and shooting them as ok but in truth whilst we are prepared to accept the ever widening gap between the hugely wealthy and the poor, the scams of the rich, the politicians, the CEO's of privatised companies and the relentless unfair cuts to all welfare recipients and God Forbid the middle classes and not forgetting the sum outcome of this is the outrageous xenophobic reaction now to those who are perfectly entitled to come and work in this country actually producing a net gain to the GDP, we all fail to see the real issues?

Until some real effort, money and investment is put into the ever increasingly large areas of deprivation we will continue to see riots and gangs. Its the inevitable result of people feeling they are on the rubbish heap. But of course it won't happen because there is really no desire to make it happen. As long as "these people" only shoot and kill each other and not "the nice people" we can live with it? And if they really get out of order we can just go in and shoot them..it will have the support of the rest of society?


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
09 January 2014 14:04
RedChecker
Photographer
RedChecker
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United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

What utter tosh!

Coming from a poor background is no excuse for becoming a violent/criminally minded thug.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Paul Hodson is off-line
09 January 2014 14:16
mph
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mph
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United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from OldMaster
Judge, opinion and justice served out by forum..as usual. Guess we can all wait for the tabloids to tell us the real truth about the trial! How many on here were in the court then?



I understand the jury was present.................?

Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk


Tempus Fugit is off-lineSilver Member
09 January 2014 16:21
pinkbuildingphotography
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pinkbuildingphotography
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United Kingdom
Tayside


I do not like the idea of people being killed at all. I think that the people saying he deserved it are being very blase.
I really do not like the idea of extra judicial killings.
It leads down a path to Argentina, Chile etc. Circa 1960's and 1070's: Operation Condor.


The state must justify their actions. Especially if the state kills someone. They have done so here. Whether the correct decision has been made is one that can never be fully answered. Some people will agree with what the police did. Some will think that they committed murder no matter what happens.

Personally, I do not think that the police kill people lightly. They will have thought that he was armed and dangerous. Whether they should have shot him I do not know. Officers have to account for their actions. Which they did to the Jury's satisfaction.


Riding on the Gotterdammerung. Down and down she goes. Where she stops no one knows.


Steve Guy is off-line
09 January 2014 16:53
Sdeve
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Derbyshire
Derby

Quote from mph
I understand the jury was present.................?






Two of whom disagreed with the verdict.


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
09 January 2014 17:01
RedChecker
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RedChecker
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United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

Quote from Sdeve


Two of whom disagreed with the verdict.



Good job they were in the minority then.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.


Paul Hodson is off-line
09 January 2014 17:49
mph
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mph
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United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from Sdeve


Two of whom disagreed with the verdict.



And 10 of whom didn't?
Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk



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