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Keeping References Private?!?!

Skymouse is off-lineGold Member
11 May 2013 17:42
skymouse
Photographer
skymouse
Location
United Kingdom
London
London

Quote from fishing
I can`t understand,why photographer can leave negative feedback to model and model can`t. It`s always two site of story.



I think the way the feedback system works, if A gives B a negative feedback, B is automatically blocked from leaving any feedback for A. As I understand it, this is to prevent retaliatory feedback. It expect it's the same regardless of whether it's a photographer or a model that made the initial feedback.

"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx.


Gerry is off-line
11 May 2013 18:09
Gerry99111
Photographer
Gerry99111
Location
United Kingdom
Surrey
Guildford

Quote from fishing
Well....how do you know if the model have good attitude or not. Just because someone say something or maybe she is act because the photographer completely an .............. The only you can find, when you meet person face to face. The reality is true. For one photographer maybe she is good,for an other, not.


You cannot ever find anything out for certain - but if you were considering booking someone and someone says somethingnegative that you believe, you can avoid a shoot.

It is better to avoid a bad shoot and risk missing a good one than to go into a shoot risking a bad one. You are cutting the risks by asking others opinion who you believe will give you a reasonable answer
If you have to ask why I do it, you will never understand the reason why


Purestorm is off-line
11 May 2013 18:11
Purestorm
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
East Sussex


Quote from skymouse
I think the way the feedback system works, if A gives B a negative feedback, B is automatically blocked from leaving any feedback for A. As I understand it, this is to prevent retaliatory feedback. It expect it's the same regardless of whether it's a photographer or a model that made the initial feedback.

You are correct ~ Guideline 14 explains how things work :-
G14 ~§~ The Feedback System ~§~


Iain Thomson is off-linePlatinum Member
12 May 2013 02:51
IainT
Photographer
IainT
Location
United Kingdom
Bedfordshire


Just a thought...

The referrence system here is far from perfect, in fact to be honest the public ref system is at best useless and at worst dangerious as it can give models a false sense of security. How many models can put their hands up and say truthfully that they have not left a positive reference when it should have been neutral at best or not left a referrence at all when they should have left a negative reference. Not many i suspect.

Although the benefit of a model site like this where the majority of amateur/adult/glamour mdels/photographers are registered, should be the ability to contact other members for private refs, of course if the party contacted still doesn,t tell the truth, which often happens, or behaves like the OP describes, then its of little benefit either.

I,m constantly shocked and disappointed at the lack of respect and regard for their colleauges safety shown by some, often experienced models. Its almost as they think, well i took my chance, so should she.

Although at least this site does offer some controls. In Europe, not so much Czech and Hungary, where the industry tends to be fairly Professional, but in most other parts, models safety is a big problem. There is no real ref system or independent network, most bookings are done via agencies who have little regard for models safety. This often shows with the model. In my experience often the attitude of a european model is to expect something unpleasant to happen, you can see it by her body language in shoots. When the penny drops that she is safe and nothing untoward will happen you can virtually see a transformation in her demeanor.

Models are lucky in the UK that they are relatively safe, and in the main have decent working conditions, so they should protect this and protect each other and be honest.
I tend to be a modest man, but then I do have a lot to be modest about.


Gerry is off-line
12 May 2013 03:15
Gerry99111
Photographer
Gerry99111
Location
United Kingdom
Surrey
Guildford

The are benefits with the existing reference system:

1) it at least gives a flavour.
2) a poor or reserved references is a good clue to steer away
3) they are an independant point of contact for you to approach ie the portfolio is not in control of the link
4) The portfolio poster putting pictures up only is in complete control of who you can approach for a reference
If you have to ask why I do it, you will never understand the reason why


Paul Venn is off-lineSilver Member
12 May 2013 04:16
jpv
Photographer
jpv
Location
United Kingdom
Norfolk
Norwich

A reference is always a reflection on an event or repeats when working together several times. I give a reference where I would recommend the model to another photographer who I know.

However it is worth noting that one of the best models (from this site) that I worked with twice and gave a deserved glowing reference, let down lots of other people so it's dangerous to generalise.


EdT is off-line
12 May 2013 06:51
EdT
Photographer
EdT
Location
United Kingdom
Cambridgeshire


Quote from skymouse
I think the way the feedback system works, if A gives B a negative feedback, B is automatically blocked from leaving any feedback for A. As I understand it, this is to prevent retaliatory feedback. It expect it's the same regardless of whether it's a photographer or a model that made the initial feedback.




So, person A shoots with person B. Person B was absolutely terrible during the shhot and knows that they are going to get a negative feedback. Person B quickly fires of a negative feedback for person A knowing that they can not then be criticised. You end up with the wrong person getting the negative feedback and no way to put their side of the story.


12 May 2013 17:04
Honesty
Model
This member has been suspended


Quote from jpv
A reference is always a reflection on an event or repeats when working together several times. I give a reference where I would recommend the model to another photographer who I know.

However it is worth noting that one of the best models (from this site) that I worked with twice and gave a deserved glowing reference, let down lots of other people so it's dangerous to generalise.



+1 I found out recently that a photographer I worked with and seemed fair enough to me is now in prison for dateraping models and before I worked with him I got a private ref from a model.


Peter Roach is off-lineGold Member
12 May 2013 20:55
flashysnapper
Photographer
flashysnapper
Location
United Kingdom
Staffordshire
burton on trent

Quote from EdT
So, person A shoots with person B. Person B was absolutely terrible during the shhot and knows that they are going to get a negative feedback. Person B quickly fires of a negative feedback for person A knowing that they can not then be criticised. You end up with the wrong person getting the negative feedback and no way to put their side of the story.



In a case like this I believe person A can contact the site mods explaining the circumstances from their point of view and ask for the negative feedback to be removed.


Purestorm is off-line
13 May 2013 01:05
Purestorm
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
East Sussex


Quote from EdT
 You end up with the wrong person getting the negative feedback and no way to put their side of the story.


You are incorrect ~ Guideline 14 explains how things work :-
G14 ~§~ The Feedback System ~§~





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