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Fresh face to Fine Art Nude! Advice needed ...

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w4pictures is off-line
05 November 2012 08:41
w4pictures
Photographer
w4pictures
Location
United Kingdom
London
Chiswick

I know you asked for models' input, but I'll add here that I agree with what Colin says.

A short time spent trawling Purestorm will show you a broad spectrum - just choose the photographers you admire. Then check refs.

Your port shows promise. There's no reason why you shouldn't have fulfilling and creative times ahead!


Durham Photographics is off-lineSilver Member
05 November 2012 09:29
Sarge
Photographer
Sarge
Location
United Kingdom
County Durham


Quote from mgphotomedia

There are plenty of photographers here that will pay to shoot you 'nude in front of camera' but don't fool yourself that it'll be art. To be truthful your statement causes me to wonder whether you have the right attitude towards modelling in order to become a good model - in any genre. At the moment your portfolio contains nothing to suggest that you have any modelling skills whatsoever - so ask yourself why anybody (and I'm sure there will be plenty!) would be willing to pay you...


I'm afraid there's no shortcut to becoming a good art model. OK you can pay a good photographer to pose you in a particular way, light you in a particular way and tell you everything you want to hear about how great you look. It doesn't make you a good model though - the skill is all the photographer's. Is that how you want your modelling to be defined?


Becoming a good art model starts with an attitude and state of mind - followed by plenty of creativity, determination and hard work. I'm not sure that you've understood that yet. Good luck though



I would like to give my interpretation of this post as i can see where mg is coming from.
I knew slimline read it as being nasty, but lets look at it as a constructive post instead.

MG has already given you a good comment on one of your photos back in Oct, so i dont think he meant this post to sound nasty.

As scarecrow said, photographers (like most people) have limited funds (this goes for good photographers also), so will most likely shoot someone more established than a newer model, for money. This is what mg meant, there will always be those who will shoot newer models for the same money, but these may also be the ones who pounce on newer models to 'get in first'. This may not add anything to your port to help you with more bookings.
Ask yourself, do you want some great art images of you, or are you not too bothered and just want to make a few quid? Which attitude do you have (both are not right or wrong BTW)?

MG also said that your port doesnt show that you have any modelling skills what so ever. Again, try to look at this as being contructive (difficult i know, due to the tone of it) and ask yourself 'which one of your photos shows modelling skills'? I dont mean to sound negative (i actually like your pose in your fine art shot, despite it being 'up nose'), but what have you got to offer that others dont (This is not meant as a statement, but as a question to ask yourself)?

Put it another way, if you are going to get an extension done on your house, would you pick someone who has been doing it for 5 years with a good portfolio of work and lots of experience that they can prove, or would you go for someone who has done it for a couple of months with a slim portfolio and nothing much to prove what they can achieve, but who charges the same?

Your attitude to modelling may not be bad (i do agree that you should charge photographers who cant give you anything in return), but you may be better tweaking your attitude towards photographers with a view of what they can do to help you and you them (some can, some cant), and not as a money purse to put bread on your table.

My advice to you (take it or leave it) would be to get some GREAT images under your belt and therefore some valuable experience. If this means putting nude/topless on hold then so be it. Get some shoots done with a few good photographers (either you pay or TF) so people are grabbed by your look and want to see more. Then go looking for paid work at the levels you have set out to do.

Please PLEASE take this as constructive. I dont mean to offend, but writing these can sometimes be read different ways.
I do REALLY like your look and would love to shoot you and want to see you do really well too.
Take advice for what it is, and ignore the rest.

Also, one last thing, in modelling (both modelling and photography) there are some nasty people around, some will speak their minds without any thought for feelings. You have to learn to grow a VERY thick skin.


06 November 2012 15:43
slimline000
Model


Quote from Scarecrow
Well thank you for the kind words Chrissie, very much appreciated.  To the OP I know you have already acknowledged the good advice that Chrissie has given you, and can't add a lot more.  All I would say from a photographer's viewpoint is that due to your inexperience you don't yet have a very strong portfolio but, from your castings, you are looking to be paid when booked.  I don't recall you quoting any rates, but for any photographer who has limited funds available for booking models, you have to remember that you are effectively in competition with more experienced models.  Having worked with models such as Chrissie, I know that her rates are very competetive but, more importantly, I know that I will get some excellent images from working with her, and will get value for money.  I can't say with confidence that the same would be true if I took a chance on booking you.

It's obvious from the shots that you do have in your portfolio that you are an attractive lady and that you have a good figure, but that will not be enough if you struggle to present yourself well when in front of the camera.  Much of this obviously comes with experience, and if you can work with some good photographers to start with, I am sure they will be able to help you and hopefully will also be able to provide some stronger images with which to boost your portfolio.

I hope these comments have been constructive, as I think you deserve to do well in your chosen genre and wish you well.




Thank you very much its advise like this i appreciate and will definitely take on board! Take care and good luck yo you too


06 November 2012 15:43
slimline000
Model


Quote from w4pictures
I know you asked for models' input, but I'll add here that I agree with what Colin says.

A short time spent trawling Purestorm will show you a broad spectrum - just choose the photographers you admire. Then check refs.

Your port shows promise. There's no reason why you shouldn't have fulfilling and creative times ahead!


Thank you



06 November 2012 15:45
slimline000
Model


Quote from pinkbuildingphotography
In advice I would say work hard and be on time and see what a photographer is trying to acheive and aim to help the photographer acheive that.

I would second the point as I am another photographer with very limited funds.  I will look for the very best models and I have to say I have worked (and paid for) some of the very best on here.

I think that in your case you have the potential to be an excellent model.  If you are good then you will get work for years and repeat booking and will eb able to model as long as you want. 

For example I worked with Joceline two weeks ago and have already booked her for next April.  I am a repeat customer for her and she has always delivered with the shots (even where I have failed).

If you work with some people in the short term who are good then people like me will come along and will (and pay) book you again and again as we can trust you to deliver good shots.



Thank you, duly noted


06 November 2012 15:48
slimline000
Model


Quote from ColinPierce


Nice apology.


For my part I think you are restricting yourself a bit too much. The very best ESTABLISHED photographers on here rarely do tf work as they are far too busy. You have to pay them for the quality work you need. If you're willing to pay then all well and good. There are some excellent photographers however, that are not that established and are more than willing to do tf work to help you build a good range of work. The one thing I would suggest though is always, always and I mean ALWAYS look at their references.

Like everything in life though practice makes perfect. The more you shoot the more comfortable you will be come, the more comfortable you become, the more relaxed you are and before you know it, you suddenly discover you have a style all of your own. Initially it will be guided by the photographers but as you learn what they want you will start to anticipate their needs and hey presto.

As for length of career, the only advise I can give on that is that your career will be as long as you want it to be. However, look after yourself, healthy and balanced diet and exercise are not just catch phrases. Believe it or not, they work. Luckily I am other side of camera so I can let myself go to seed lol.

Reputation goes a long way too. Always be on time, never just not turn up. Plenty of rest before a shoot (nothing worse than a model turning up hungover and with bags under eyes).

From what I can see from your port you will at some point have a huge amount to offer and I am sure with hard work you will be a great success.



Thank you thats some very valid advice and i will defintely take notice! Thank you for the support


06 November 2012 15:51
slimline000
Model


Quote from Sarge


I would like to give my interpretation of this post as i can see where mg is coming from.
I knew slimline read it as being nasty, but lets look at it as a constructive post instead.

MG has already given you a good comment on one of your photos back in Oct, so i dont think he meant this post to sound nasty.

As scarecrow said, photographers (like most people) have limited funds (this goes for good photographers also), so will most likely shoot someone more established than a newer model, for money. This is what mg meant, there will always be those who will shoot newer models for the same money, but these may also be the ones who pounce on newer models to 'get in first'. This may not add anything to your port to help you with more bookings.
Ask yourself, do you want some great art images of you, or are you not too bothered and just want to make a few quid? Which attitude do you have (both are not right or wrong BTW)?

MG also said that your port doesnt show that you have any modelling skills what so ever. Again, try to look at this as being contructive (difficult i know, due to the tone of it) and ask yourself 'which one of your photos shows modelling skills'? I dont mean to sound negative (i actually like your pose in your fine art shot, despite it being 'up nose'), but what have you got to offer that others dont (This is not meant as a statement, but as a question to ask yourself)?

Put it another way, if you are going to get an extension done on your house, would you pick someone who has been doing it for 5 years with a good portfolio of work and lots of experience that they can prove, or would you go for someone who has done it for a couple of months with a slim portfolio and nothing much to prove what they can achieve, but who charges the same?

Your attitude to modelling may not be bad (i do agree that you should charge photographers who cant give you anything in return), but you may be better tweaking your attitude towards photographers with a view of what they can do to help you and you them (some can, some cant), and not as a money purse to put bread on your table.

My advice to you (take it or leave it) would be to get some GREAT images under your belt and therefore some valuable experience. If this means putting nude/topless on hold then so be it. Get some shoots done with a few good photographers (either you pay or TF) so people are grabbed by your look and want to see more. Then go looking for paid work at the levels you have set out to do.

Please PLEASE take this as constructive. I dont mean to offend, but writing these can sometimes be read different ways.
I do REALLY like your look and would love to shoot you and want to see you do really well too.
Take advice for what it is, and ignore the rest.

Also, one last thing, in modelling (both modelling and photography) there are some nasty people around, some will speak their minds without any thought for feelings. You have to learn to grow a VERY thick skin.



Thats very kind of you and thank you for finding the time to write! I will take note of what everyone has says and i think i definitely have a clearer idea of what to do now. And you do make some very valid points in your statements! Thank you


Christopher Vian-Smith is off-lineSilver Member
06 November 2012 15:57
ChrisVS
Photographer
ChrisVS
Location
United Kingdom
London
London

Well I for one would probably do a paid art nude shoot with you.
www.chrisvs.com


Missie is off-line
15 November 2012 07:15
Missie0290
Model
Missie0290
Location
United Kingdom
Merseyside
Newton-le-Willows

Quote from slimline000
Well? Firstly i wont sink to your level as that is very clearly low! But to be honest thats a very strong statement coming from someone who portfolio is mediocre at best? I may not have much experience but im sure even a neanderthal could see that! I didnt asked to be slandered which is exactly what this is, its definitely not positive or constructive in any respect at all. In case you missed it because there are several references to the fact i am new and im asking for advice? And as for working with good photographers I want to work with others i know will be professional which is clearly a skill you seem to lack from your comments!

This is a part time hobby for me and i dont see how you can see from less than five pics and three lines on my profile you can tell that i have no talent for modelling? I have spoke to quite a few established photographers and all the feedback i have had has been constructive and positive. So watch this space is all im going to say to you



If you don't want honest advice don't ask on a forum. I thought MGs advice was fair. I'm new to using this forum, But I frequent another forum, none modelling related but very heated, I think i can spot a level headed poster when i see one, and i would certainly put MG under that heading.
"[Toni] has a short fuse when it comes to stupidity"



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