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Chaperones ( Yes, it's that time again!)

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Paul Hodson is off-line
26 June 2012 11:47
mph
Photographer
mph
Location
United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from russtyruss
your point is??



It's just a tiny bit insulting?
Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk


Russ Goodban is off-line
26 June 2012 14:24
russtyruss
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Kent
Broadstairs

maybe it is. but in my opinion so is telling a young girl that's never met you before that they can't bring anyone with them just because you dont want the percieved hassle or what not.

dont get me wrong, the last shoot i did was with a 17 year old, her mum was present and her mum kept trying to direct the shoot. it russtyruss is a naughty person ed me off but i dealt with it and got some great shots.

as far as i'm concerned, that's all part of being a photographer. I was in paris not so long ago and my friend was shooting for Nylon magazine in the jardine du tulieres (probably spelt wrong but i don't care) the model was basically wearing a see through dress with nothing on underneath, and as you'd expect, it drew quite a crowd. did my friend mind? no. did the model mind? no. that's why they're pros.

for a model on here starting out, or even a quite established one, i don't feel they should be slagged off for wanting to take precautions when meeting a new photographer, as long as the person they bring with them has been agreed before hand and that they dont interfere with the shoot. same if i have an assistant, i'll agree it with the model before hand.

all i was trying to say is that if find it quite arrogant that some photographers think it's their 'right' to work one on one with a model.

russ.


Peter Hague is off-line
26 June 2012 14:31
PeterH
Photographer
PeterH
Location
United Kingdom
South Yorkshire


Quote from russtyruss
 all i was trying to say is that if find it quite arrogant that some photographers think it's their 'right' to work one on one with a model. russ.



It's the photographers right to work under any T&C's he wishes. It's the models right to work under any T&C's she wishes.

It is no-ones right to assume there are dubious motives for anyone wishing to work under those T&C's
"I am the one who knocks" - Walter White


Gerry is off-line
26 June 2012 14:37
Gerry99111
Photographer
Gerry99111
Location
United Kingdom
Surrey
Guildford

Quote from russtyruss
all i was trying to say is that if find it quite arrogant that some photographers think it's their 'right' to work one on one with a model. russ.



Its seriously arrogant of you to dictate terms of how two adults should arrange to do a shoot together and none of your business.

I dont think its my right to impose anything on a model but if I am not happy with the terms of the shoot, it will never happen, no matter what you say. The model has no right to impose a shoot with a chaperone on me. The model is free to decide whether to do a shoot with me just the same as I am free to turn down a shoot with a model

If you have to ask why I do it, you will never understand the reason why


Paul Hodson is off-line
26 June 2012 14:55
mph
Photographer
mph
Location
United Kingdom
Cheshire
Crewe

Quote from russtyruss

one of the arguments that came up quite a lot was that the 'tog didn't need any distractions. well, on a 'pro' shoot(I mean, pro as in proper editorial etc) there are always at least five or six people there, and i mean right there. in the room/on set next to you. fussing about. mua's, hair, stylists, assistants... the photographers deal with it because they are pro.



There is a hell of a difference between professional assistants - and mothers, boy friends, mates etc!

But as said above - everyone is free to have their own requirements and for the other party to accept or reject them. I would not choose to work with chaperones - but nor would I slag off a model who wished to bring one.
Amateur - happy to do TF with models with potential and enthusiasm. Website: www.mphodson.co.uk


Russ Goodban is off-line
26 June 2012 15:11
russtyruss
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Kent
Broadstairs

Quote from Gerry99111
Its seriously arrogant of you to dictate terms of how two adults should arrange to do a shoot together and none of your business.




I'm not trying to dictate to anyone and agreed, it is none of my business what you do. you're misunderstanding what i'm getting at. i'm saying i think it's arrogant of some photographers to believe that if a model would like an escort to be present at a first shoot then, somehow, the model must be S*@t and not worth bothering with.
99.9% of photographers on here are decent guys i reckon, but there's still that 0.1% that are pervs/gwc's.
there are plenty of models that dont like chaperones and plenty that do. why automatically judge the ones that do? that's all i'm saying.


26 June 2012 17:37
1919_Images
Photographer


Quote from russtyruss


I'm not trying to dictate to anyone and agreed, it is none of my business what you do. you're misunderstanding what i'm getting at. i'm saying i think it's arrogant of some photographers to believe that if a model would like an escort to be present at a first shoot then, somehow, the model must be S*@t and not worth bothering with.
99.9% of photographers on here are decent guys i reckon, but there's still that 0.1% that are pervs/gwc's.
there are plenty of models that dont like chaperones and plenty that do. why automatically judge the ones that do? that's all i'm saying.



I've never seen any photographer claim that models who want chaperones are 1919_Images is a naughty person , their reason for not wanting to work with a chaperone present is normally down to a previous bad experience with a chaperone or just a wish to work one on one with a model which is their right, for you to claim they must be pervs because of this is out of order.
Thats why people are taking offence.

I should add that Purestorm mods often comment that a lot of problems they encounter here are from professional models offering extras to unsuspecting photographers rather than the other way round.



Russ Goodban is off-line
27 June 2012 00:16
russtyruss
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Kent
Broadstairs

Quote from 1919_Images


I've never seen any photographer claim that models who want chaperones are russtyruss is a naughty person




trust me, theres plenty of assumptions like that in the other threads about this. that's why i chimed in in the first place.


i'll guess we'll have to agree to disagree
but, i'll leave you with this. if a photographer was to go to a established model agency (img, A1, select etc...) and ask to shoot one of their 'new faces' for a test or whatever, but say that it's his 'right' to be one on one with her... he'll be escorted/laughed out of the building. fact.

regards

russ.


Quane is off-line
27 June 2012 02:11
Alister
Photographer
Alister
Location
United Kingdom
Dorset
Bournemouth

Quote from russtyruss
I'm not trying to dictate to anyone and agreed, it is none of my business what you do. you're misunderstanding what i'm getting at. i'm saying i think it's arrogant of some photographers to believe that if a model would like an escort to be present at a first shoot then, somehow, the model must be S*@t and not worth bothering with.
99.9% of photographers on here are decent guys i reckon, but there's still that 0.1% that are pervs/gwc's.
there are plenty of models that dont like chaperones and plenty that do. why automatically judge the ones that do? that's all i'm saying.



Why are you automatically judging photographers that don't allow chaperones? Very, very few working models on here like a chaperone.

As you keep referring to what professionals do, as in a professional on a proper shoot rather than selling crappy 'modelling portfolios' to those that don't know any better, how many professionals would allow the models boyfriend to hang around on set during a shoot? Or maybe in another room stealing things (and it has been known)? Can't think many would and would pack the model straight back to the agency. Under 18s are a different matter but they're not on this site.
"If i could only shoot with one photographer ever again i would pick Alister. I've grown as a model since shooting with him. " - Mimi C


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
27 June 2012 02:20
RedChecker
Photographer
RedChecker
Location
United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

Quote from mph
There is a hell of a difference between professional assistants - and mothers, boy friends, mates etc!



+1

Having had an incident of sorts myself at the weekend there's no way in hell I'm ever going to work with a chaperone present again.
When you are dead, you do not know that you are dead. All of your pain is felt by others. The same thing happens when you are stupid.



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